Zoll Lifecor

[Anonymous]

I call bull to VT probably not going to break because patient EF under 35. Worked in CCU for several years previous life. Breaks all the time and can be seen everyday in the CCU. Any of our patients that had sustained VT regardless of rate would get ICD. Yes some medical exceptions. Not sustained with lesser co morbidities we would write a vest. And we did not write many vests. Drs didn't see need for most patients. Either do I. Company is over selling this device.

So you would bet your license on VT "breaking all the time" with EF less than 35%?

When we want to decrease the risk of hypotension, cardiac arrest or neurological deficits related to a prolonged ventricular arrhythmia, it's absolutely essential to minimize the time between the onset of the ventricular arrhythmia and the defibrillation shock. The LV does this very well for the patients who need a bridge to an ICD during their waiting period.

 

[Anonymous]

So you would bet your license on VT "breaking all the time" with EF less than 35%?

When we want to decrease the risk of hypotension, cardiac arrest or neurological deficits related to a prolonged ventricular arrhythmia, it's absolutely essential to minimize the time between the onset of the ventricular arrhythmia and the defibrillation shock. The LV does this very well for the patients who need a bridge to an ICD during their waiting period.

And here we go folks with the scare tactics.."so would you be your license on it?"..I have seen this time and time again, VT breaks and patient gets ICD. LV NOT needed as patient now goes right to ICD. No need for worry about "betting the license" as the patient now qualifies for the ICD immediately and patient is protected and doc doesn't need to worry about if the patient is wearing the LV (and we all know there is well over a 70% change they aren;t wearing it!). Game, set, match..no lV needed.

 

[Anonymous]

So you would bet your license on VT "breaking all the time" with EF less than 35%?

When we want to decrease the risk of hypotension, cardiac arrest or neurological deficits related to a prolonged ventricular arrhythmia, it's absolutely essential to minimize the time between the onset of the ventricular arrhythmia and the defibrillation shock. The LV does this very well for the patients who need a bridge to an ICD during their waiting period.

Ok let's try this one more time. Grass through concrete analogy. I don't believe in paying 500,000 per life saved. Get it?? In other words your blanket approach in Rx the life vest to catch Siamese twins is antiquated. And if you really worked in a cardiology office you probably would be bitching about all the money that is being cut from echos, nuc studies and the lack of new technology being utilized by your physicians because of reimbursement. When you see the wall being torn down and the fork lift removing your nuc camera thank Lifevest. Or if your a glass half empty person don't worry you'll have a bigger break room!

 

[Anonymous]

So you would bet your license on VT "breaking all the time" with EF less than 35%?

When we want to decrease the risk of hypotension, cardiac arrest or neurological deficits related to a prolonged ventricular arrhythmia, it's absolutely essential to minimize the time between the onset of the ventricular arrhythmia and the defibrillation shock. The LV does this very well for the patients who need a bridge to an ICD during their waiting period.

Listen up mr/ mrs trainer as there is no marketing department. You keep bringing up these select patient types that the vest may be appropriate for! But let's get to the heart of the issue! The quota system here increasing by at least 3200 every month makes it impossible to remain at this company for over 2 years. In most cases 1 year. The typical patient is more like a post PCI or cabg patient with a low EF on ADMISSION, usually cath. This is the paperwork that is submitted and approved. Most of those patients have been Revascularized after there procedure and either a post echo is not performed or in most cases not submitted ! So in other words many patients are leaving the hospital with a EF greater than 35. So cut the bullshit. This is fact. This is the waste to the healthcare system. You know it your superiors know it the only people who don't know it are the majority of your new managers because they are clueless.

 

[Anonymous]

So you would bet your license on VT "breaking all the time" with EF less than 35%?

When we want to decrease the risk of hypotension, cardiac arrest or neurological deficits related to a prolonged ventricular arrhythmia, it's absolutely essential to minimize the time between the onset of the ventricular arrhythmia and the defibrillation shock. The LV does this very well for the patients who need a bridge to an ICD during their waiting period.

In response to your limited question that's the Drs call. As Mentioned they would go right to an ICD if patients had sustained VT. If patients had short runs post op usually were reperfusion arrhythmia's and Drs did not feel vest necessary. I would bet my license that you don't work for a cardiology office but the company. If you want to end the debate on how and when to use the vest than why not undertake a few clinical trials. Could it be the work was already done (ICD) and we know the answer? Don't call out my work in the CCU. Get out of the office and learn how and where your product is being used. The short time I've been here I see little usage in the north east and the majority of usage based on two factors. 1) areas of high reimbursement 2) areas were PSRs are screening and writing for the vest in order to be compensated. So please don't throw stones because it appears your house is made out of glass.

 

[Anonymous]

Ok DR. BK or JW again, the core of the argument is not whether defib is appropriate or not. From my perspective its a sophomoric argument to pigeon the entire (with me or against me) on causality. So let's just stick to evidence based medicine.

If your feeling is that Zoll is properly supporting your practice and needs, then please explain to us, as you know it the detection algorithm? Do you know said algorithm to the detail as provided by your MDT/BSX/SJM team? What is the sample rate (or did you think it was beat to beat)? To prevent R/T double count how do you adjust the amplitude? In regards to detection and discrimination, how does a single vs. dual zone detection differ in a mono/poly or VA. Ask tech support what a non-committed shock is? For your morbidly obese patients with flipping sensors, which lead or how many leads are monitoring?

Now I do not mean to pimp you because it really is a matter of semantics but, go ahead and ask the company directly similar questions as such. If you don't know ask your EP colleague to see if they have been trained to that level of detail as would be standard. They have not, will not and if ask will be told "its not necessary". The fact that they treat you and your colleagues as sophomoric should be more of a concern and as equally upsetting as the cost and over utilization. Its a dumb shock box, supported by a group of people kept in the dark as yourself.

What an ignorant post. I guess you've never heard of slow VT, we've had plenty of patients need their VT detection rates lowered on their ICD's simply because of slow VT. Personally, i've seen it down to 110 bpm. The fact of the matter is that anyone who is wearing the vest has been documented to be in a rather vulnerable postoperative state and on major physical restrictions. If their heart rate suddenly increases to 150 bpm and the device recognizes the rhythm as a ventricular focus, its a safe bet its VT. When you are dealing with someone with an LVEF of less than 35%, that specific rhythm is more than likely not going to break on its own and needs to be treated, especially if its occured while the patients on a heart failure drug regimen.

As far as you bringing up postoperative complications, medical therapy involving antiarrhythmics alone is not able to cover everyone at risk of developing a deadly arrhythmia. For you to argue that the risk of the patient going asystolic or having "complications from CABG" is not enough to warrant a temporary ICD while the patient is made to wait their 30-90 days is proposterous and rather unethical. The Zoll vest has saved a lot of lives, period.

Lastly, i'm not a "PSR" or "TM", I work in a private cardiology practice.

 

[Anonymous]

Academic cardiologists due it all the time....its called evidenced based medicine and until you have some. Hold your breath at the end of segment until you can call it "a save"....in other words shut your mouth until something worth while comes out.

So you would bet your license on VT "breaking all the time" with EF less than 35%?

When we want to decrease the risk of hypotension, cardiac arrest or neurological deficits related to a prolonged ventricular arrhythmia, it's absolutely essential to minimize the time between the onset of the ventricular arrhythmia and the defibrillation shock. The LV does this very well for the patients who need a bridge to an ICD during their waiting period.

 

[Anonymous]

So you would bet your license on VT "breaking all the time" with EF less than 35%?

When we want to decrease the risk of hypotension, cardiac arrest or neurological deficits related to a prolonged ventricular arrhythmia, it's absolutely essential to minimize the time between the onset of the ventricular arrhythmia and the defibrillation shock. The LV does this very well for the patients who need a bridge to an ICD during their waiting period.

Read between the lines here folks. Don't be confused by the medical bullshit this idiot is verbalizing. Ex- when we want to decrease the RISK of hypotension (Lol) blah blah blah RELATED TO A PROLONGED VENTRICULAR ARRHYTHMIA , it's absolutely essential to minimize the TIME between the onset of the ventricular arrhythmia AND THE DEFIBRILLATION SHOCK!!!
NOW HERES THE KICKER..... The LV does this very we'll for the patients WHO NEED A BRIDGE TO AN ICD ........ (here it comes) DURING THIER WAITING PERIOD!!!!!!
So in other words an ICD implanted will address all the same concerns the above corporate idiot is trying to confuse you with. This idiot should have said is the vest is good for protecting your patient from the same thing an ICD would , except we may find out that you may not need an ICD. But you probably will because your very very sick according to this poster. So sick that you have major restrictions..... So you might as well have an ICD put in. Sorry corporate idiot, you guys should start using a different color instead of gray! Answer one more question for us.... How many people go on to die after they have been shocked and saved???? Kind of makes you wonder who we're saving doesn't it????

 

[Anonymous]

i hate the lifevest, i hate the mis management, i hate how unethical the company encourages me to behave in the guise of marketing and concentric selling, i hate their unreal expectations and i'm miserable here.

all i can say is it took me all of 4 months to go from a happy new rep to full clarity.

 

[Anonymous]

i hate the lifevest, i hate the mis management, i hate how unethical the company encourages me to behave in the guise of marketing and concentric selling, i hate their unreal expectations and i'm miserable here.

all i can say is it took me all of 4 months to go from a happy new rep to full clarity.

POTENTIAL NEW HIRES READ THE ABOVE POST...IT IS 100% ACCURATE AND TRUE!!!

 

[Anonymous]

Couldn't agree more!!!! Sums it up perfectly!!!
JW since your pretending to work in a cardiology office (see above posts) could you do your usual spin and tell everyone why turnover is in the 70 percent range? Can you come up with some non related answer as to everyone's issue with ZOLL ? Why so many are looking to get out and why management has to try troll cafe pharma and pretend they work in cardiology offices??? How pathetic.

 

[Anonymous]

Couldn't agree more!!!! Sums it up perfectly!!!
JW since your pretending to work in a cardiology office (see above posts) could you do your usual spin and tell everyone why turnover is in the 70 percent range? Can you come up with some non related answer as to everyone's issue with ZOLL ? Why so many are looking to get out and why management has to try troll cafe pharma and pretend they work in cardiology offices??? How pathetic.

The only thing that got me through the Phoenix meeting was imagining kicking ML, JW, SB, JP, and BK's asses. What a group of slimy asshole pricks! They can all eat a fat dick!

DO. NOT. WORK. FOR. THIS. COMPANY.

 

[Anonymous]

Sorry corporate idiot, you guys should start using a different color instead of gray! Answer one more question for us.... How many people go on to die after they have been shocked and saved???? Kind of makes you wonder who we're saving doesn't it????

That's the thing...at ZOLL, a shock = a "save"!

2 things I'll add to the above excerpt:

1. Many of these "saved" patients are too sick and will go on to die anyway. For these patients an ICD would most likely not save them either despite it's faster time to treatment.

and

2. Ask yourself this; if the LifeVest is SUCH an efficacious and effective therapy to protect patients during "the highest risk period" and it has been around since 2001...WHY IN THE HELL haven't major device companies (MDT, STJ, BS) jumped onboard and produced their own???

 

[Anonymous]

i hate the lifevest, i hate the mis management, i hate how unethical the company encourages me to behave in the guise of marketing and concentric selling, i hate their unreal expectations and i'm miserable here.

all i can say is it took me all of 4 months to go from a happy new rep to full clarity.

questionable things happen here

 

[Anonymous]

LV is a great product to sell , and continues its strong momentum. Very glad to be part of the futur here. Saving lives and making good money is a great feeling!!!

 

[Anonymous]

LV is a great product to sell , and continues its strong momentum. Very glad to be part of the futur here. Saving lives and making good money is a great feeling!!!

HA HA HA HA HA!!! Here's another one: BK walks into JW's Office and sees him whooping and hollering.

"What's the matter JW" BK inquired.

"Nothing at all, slave. I just done finished a jigsaw puzzle in record time!" JW beams.

"How long did it take you?"

"Well, the box said '3 to 5 Years' but I did it in a month!"

 

[Anonymous]

LV is a great product to sell , and continues its strong momentum. Very glad to be part of the futur here. Saving lives and making good money is a great feeling!!!

Obviously posted by one of two groups; 1. someone who does not work here or 2. Senior Management.

First, LV is NOT a great product to sell...quite the opposite actually! Second, there is no "future" at ZOLL. Third, IF (very big if with no RCT to validate it) the LV does in fact save lives it is such a small percentage that it is not relevant. Finally, if you consider $75,000 good money then yes, you are making good money!

 

[Anonymous]

its a salesmans product. Do your job with concentric selling and add value to your physician by educating them. WE have so many toolls in our bag. use them and stop bitchin.

Ok I've got a great concentric statement. What do you think? Dr just think of the vest as flight insurance. If you go down your covered. What? you don't buy flight insurance because it's so rare that a plane goes down ? We'll we claim our save rate is around 1%, (even though we shock VT around 150 which most likely would have broke on its own-and here it's a save) And Dr we charge the insurance company 3000 per month for our flight insurance. Oh and I forgot to mention if the insurance company only allows for 2500 out of that 3000 your patient will get balanced billed for 1500 dollars. What did you say? It's better to go down in the plane??

 

[Anonymous]

LV is a great product to sell , and continues its strong momentum. Very glad to be part of the futur here. Saving lives and making good money is a great feeling!!!

This is why you should stay here! And when your fired take a look at applied medical or KCI. AS A MANAGER these are the only companies outside of pharm that you are qualified for. In most cases here and I'm sure your one, management has no cardiac experience. And for you pharm managers no selling Lipitor and norvasc doesn't equate to cardiac experience. So ask yourself what value do you bring to your team? If your team consists of pharm reps like yourself than you can all stumble around and pretend your saving lives and bringing value. If your a manager who has a team of med device reps who are experienced you bring no value. It's not your fault your superiors have put you in a losing scenario. Your team will always know more than you so continue managing your strengths- administrative duties. You are not qualified to talk about concentric selling with Drs because outside of an opening question you do not understand what the Dr is saying. You cannot read documents therefore many of you have no idea if a patient is qualified for a vest or not. You do not know where patients originate in the sales process again not your fault because your superiors are pushing this product into the cardiology office. Ask your self this question where am I better able to find patients. Office? hospital? Other? You have nomidea. You listen to corporate who is chasing the flavor of the month "heart failure patients" because somebody in corporate read an article in field and stream stating there are x number of diagnosed heart failure patients each year. So ask your self when a patient is diagnosed with heart failure in a cardiology office after an echo. What is the next step? Lifevest? If you don't know the answer than you do not know where to find patients and you are not qualified to be a manager. Add in the fact that you do not get copies of CCR reports so you have no idea how the company is managing your sales reps patients. That's right if you haven't figured it out yet customer service has been removed from your control. And I forgot to mention that your inventory is also out of your hands. One half of the critical makeup of your sales reps success customer service has been delighted to a costco worker who doesn't care if your patient raps the vest around his dog when he goes to bed. And in fact most of you managers could care less about these issues because you don't see the CCR reports. Mention this fact to a manager and he gives you a look like a patient that has a 15 second pause in his EKG. He then ignores your cries for help because tech support has destroyed your relationship with your customer and tells you to bring on new patients because he doesn't know how to interpret a report that states your largest customer Dr X hasn't written a vest in over a year. Even though you sat in a lunch with dr x and your boss watched the dr say to his nurse put mr jones on a Lifevest. The NP signed the MO right in front of you but the report your tool of a manager is interpreting doesn't have Dr x actually putting his name on a mo so he is not a supporter! Does this sound like you Mr pharm manager??? Yeah your right I can see why you like saving life's and making money! You probably are reading your paycheck like the reports you are interpreting!

 

[Anonymous]

LV is a great product to sell , and continues its strong momentum. Very glad to be part of the futur here. Saving lives and making good money is a great feeling!!!

This is why you should stay here! And when your fired take a look at applied medical or KCI. AS A MANAGER these are the only companies outside of pharm that you are qualified for. In most cases here and I'm sure your one, management has no cardiac experience. And for you pharm managers no selling Lipitor and norvasc doesn't equate to cardiac experience. So ask yourself what value do you bring to your team? If your team consists of pharm reps like yourself than you can all stumble around and pretend your saving lives and bringing value. If your a manager who has a team of med device reps who are experienced you bring no value. It's not your fault your superiors have put you in a losing scenario. Your team will always know more than you so continue managing your strengths- administrative duties. You are not qualified to talk about concentric selling with Drs because outside of an opening question you do not understand what the Dr is saying. You cannot read documents therefore many of you have no idea if a patient is qualified for a vest or not. You do not know where patients originate in the sales process again not your fault because your superiors are pushing this product into the cardiology office. Ask your self this question where am I better able to find patients. Office? hospital? Other? You have nomidea. You listen to corporate who is chasing the flavor of the month "heart failure patients" because somebody in corporate read an article in field and stream stating there are x number of diagnosed heart failure patients each year. So ask your self when a patient is diagnosed with heart failure in a cardiology office after an echo. What is the next step? Lifevest? If you don't know the answer than you do not know where to find patients and you are not qualified to be a manager. Add in the fact that you do not get copies of CCR reports so you have no idea how the company is managing your sales reps patients. That's right if you haven't figured it out yet customer service has been removed from your control. And I forgot to mention that your inventory is also out of your hands. One half of the critical makeup of your sales reps success customer service has been delegated to a costco worker who doesn't care if your patient raps the vest around his dog when he goes to bed. And in fact most of you managers could care less about these issues because you don't see the CCR reports. Mention this fact to a manager and he gives you a look like a patient that has a 15 second pause in his EKG. He then ignores your cries for help because tech support has destroyed your relationship with your customer and tells you to bring on new patients because he doesn't know how to interpret a report that states your largest customer Dr X hasn't written a vest in over a year. Even though you sat in a lunch with dr x and your boss watched the dr say to his nurse put mr jones on a Lifevest. The NP signed the MO right in front of you but the report your tool of a manager is interpreting doesn't have Dr x actually putting his name on a mo so he is not a supporter! Does this sound like you Mr pharm manager??? Yeah your right I can see why you like saving life's and making money! You probably are reading your paycheck like the reports you are interpreting!