Warning to all appliants!

[Anonymous]

To get rolled over you must believe in the numbers they give you. It's made up. If you have the chance sit with your direct counterpart and look at the same doc with the same time, Nrx, Trx whatever and guess what. It doesn't match. I found this out and asked my manager why is this different? This put me on the radar screen and before I knew it, I was looked at as having a bad attitude. The above poster is right. If you have a problem or a question, do not go to your manager. This will only cause them to have to think of an excuse and the last thing they want to do is think. They want enthustic, robotic, box checkers that think this is the greatest job ever and believe them when they speak of roll over or contract extention. If you want a job that goes from year to year with only hope of getting signed onto a new contract. That is to say they have one avaiable. If you fit the above criteria they Pharma Contract sales is right for you. If you are a free thinker with good ideas and think that working hard and most importantly producing results will get you ahead your only half right. Remember the results (made up) and the working hard stuff. Well unlike most jobs where it will make you stand out, you might get an atta boy for having a high call average and not get put on the list that says you only make 3 calls a day. Quick fix there by using the detail no sample box. FYI Black Box warning here is that if you want a job that gains you little and are willing to start over year after year then this might be for you. For me, I got off this merry go around and at first I missed the pay check and the interactions with my doctor friends. Then, I got a job that rewarded me for my efforts and gave me hope for a better future. I need to produce results and continue to work hard. Bu there is no looking down on me from others and I know where I stand at the end of the day or year. I wonder now why I ever got started in contract. I think like most I was let go from direct ect employment in pharma because of downsizing and this will continue. But contract was there and I go some money in their salary but bought into their pipe dream of bonus and roll over. Neither of them happened and before I knew it it was time for the phone call of stay at home today and we will call you to let you know if you have a job tomorrow. My suggestion and it is just that. Take your self esteem and your belief in hard work pays off and get out of not just pharma but for sure contract pharma it's a dead end.

Many times they adjust the numbers to promote certain individuals. They screwed over a friend of mine and were adjusting their numbers so that they would not be promoted. A manager of mine admitted that they thought that was going on as they decided to leave the company for a direct position. Your true attitude has nothing to do with it. You can be a total asshole. If the client likes you, you're good. You can have a great attitude and they'll make you look evil to justify not rolling you over. Some of it has to do with a client being threatened by an individual's past experience. I watched this dude get buried because I truly believe they were afraid that he had too much management potential and he made people nervous.

 

[Anonymous]

Many times they adjust the numbers to promote certain individuals. They screwed over a friend of mine and were adjusting their numbers so that they would not be promoted. A manager of mine admitted that they thought that was going on as they decided to leave the company for a direct position. Your true attitude has nothing to do with it. You can be a total asshole. If the client likes you, you're good. You can have a great attitude and they'll make you look evil to justify not rolling you over. Some of it has to do with a client being threatened by an individual's past experience. I watched this dude get buried because I truly believe they were afraid that he had too much management potential and he made people nervous.

Strange industry for sure.
If you are under 40-45, I would strongly advise switching industries. Leave this place to the foolish that don't know any better.
Its an industry that thrives on falsehood.
Publicis is the worst. Strange managers. And a weirdo in Southern California who should stop drinking.

 

[Anonymous]

Going to a manager in contract is never a good idea even if you show diplomacy because the manager can do nothing but hear your complaint, monitor you, and report you as someone that could be a potential threat. Even if you are positive and especially if you provide a solid solution with respect; You will be watched and the documentation process to get you out will have just begun. If you follow up with your manager, they will tell you it's being taken care of and technically they handle it by pushing the person who submitted the complaint out. This did not happen to me personally, but I have watched it occur at least three or four times with others in the past. I did not think they were offensive or insubordinate. They were performers with very good reputations.
The managers job in contract, is to see that the herd is going wherever they're or led to and to report those that think independently. As a manager, you get away with having a little bit more independent thought on contract, however you are always outside of the respected circle of leadership that works directly for a client on a project. The pecking order is a solid hierararcial structure where the contract representative is on the absolute lowest level. It's sad and a bit ridiculous.

I have a gut feel that the previous post is either in HR or is a contract manager that has become very comfortable with being an authority albeit in a lower position in the grand scheme of management versus the client, but still above the sales rep level. I guess as long as you're not the lowest man on the totem pol, it suits them.

The best reps do think independently, but they also follow direction. The ones who write the checks that end up in your bank account are the deciders. This is true of any business. Not sure how it can be sad or ridiculous that representatives are on the lowest level of the strategic decision making hierarchy. Their job is not to make strategic decisions, it is to carry them out.

Representative isn't an insignificant role. It is actually the most important one. Just so you know, the most senior management of this company actively solicits feedback all the time. It is a constant dialogue. They don't see it as "us" vs. "them" they see it as "us". They do not always change course because of feedback, but sometimes they do. Either way, they listen.

You never said what the "complaints" were that led to the 3 or 4 examples you witnessed. Seems you have an easier time expressing your gut feel than you do describing actual events that may give credibility to your argument. It doesn't bother me, but you seem to have a perception of how things work that isn't consistent with mine. Maybe you can help me see things differently.

It isn't all wonderful in any company, or business, or in life in general. Sometimes bad things happen to good people. I am personally proud of this company, which is why I took the time to respond here. The lowest part of the totem pole is the part that keeps the whole thing standing. There is no conspiracy to get rid of people with good ideas or constructive suggestions. Malcontents and weak links, on the other hand, like termites, have to go. Everyone else works too hard.

 

[Anonymous]

The best reps do think independently, but they also follow direction. The ones who write the checks that end up in your bank account are the deciders. This is true of any business. Not sure how it can be sad or ridiculous that representatives are on the lowest level of the strategic decision making hierarchy. Their job is not to make strategic decisions, it is to carry them out.

Representative isn't an insignificant role. It is actually the most important one. Just so you know, the most senior management of this company actively solicits feedback all the time. It is a constant dialogue. They don't see it as "us" vs. "them" they see it as "us". They do not always change course because of feedback, but sometimes they do. Either way, they listen.

You never said what the "complaints" were that led to the 3 or 4 examples you witnessed. Seems you have an easier time expressing your gut feel than you do describing actual events that may give credibility to your argument. It doesn't bother me, but you seem to have a perception of how things work that isn't consistent with mine. Maybe you can help me see things differently.

It isn't all wonderful in any company, or business, or in life in general. Sometimes bad things happen to good people. I am personally proud of this company, which is why I took the time to respond here. The lowest part of the totem pole is the part that keeps the whole thing standing. There is no conspiracy to get rid of people with good ideas or constructive suggestions. Malcontents and weak links, on the other hand, like termites, have to go. Everyone else works too hard.

I'm not sure about the previous poster and what they were referring to regarding the three to four people; but a few other posters specifically mentioned that numbers are being manipulated. I've even heard this. When we compare numbers with partners and employees of the direct client, they don't match. I think many of us think that there is something wrong with altering numbers in ways that are dishonest. Why try to undermine a representative?

Also, claiming that representatives being let go are like "termites" or "weak links" is not always quite accurate. Let's be honest. If a client has issues that are not quite legitimate or above board, the disliked definitely appears to experience their numbers starting to head South. It doesn't help your case when district managers agree that they see this as well. Some of these low men/women on the totem pol have had pretty strong backgrounds with experience that many times does include management. It seems that these guys do deserve more respect. I've seen them get treated pretty disrespectfully.

 

[Anonymous]

I think that people should be prepared in knowing that if you work contract, there are more chiefs in contract than you would expect to have to answer to as compared to working directly for a client. A contract sales rep must answers to direct reps. You have to understand that you are not on equal footing.

 

[Anonymous]

I think that people should be prepared in knowing that if you work contract, there are more chiefs in contract than you would expect to have to answer to as compared to working directly for a client. A contract sales rep must answers to direct reps. You have to understand that you are not on equal footing.

True dat.
Wish I never got started in contract.
Ruined my resume too much.

 

[Anonymous]

And you are a female with a pair. So, lose a pair?
Have fun in your life of lies and misery.
You are not fooling anyone.

Are you talking about the rep/manager out of Southern Cali? What's with the lies and misery? Just curious. LoL

 

[Anonymous]

Are you talking about the rep/manager out of Southern Cali? What's with the lies and misery? Just curious. LoL

Isn't this the case with most corporate jobs?
The word corporation is derived from the word corpse, which refers to death.
Its all a joke.
Working for the corporation is the worst move anyone can make in their life. Better to make less and go non corporate. Better to start a small business and even make less. Better to not even bother with these people.
They are mostly dead on the inside, rotting with their lies and ego driven agendas.

 

[Anonymous]

Isn't this the case with most corporate jobs?
The word corporation is derived from the word corpse, which refers to death.
Its all a joke.
Working for the corporation is the worst move anyone can make in their life. Better to make less and go non corporate. Better to start a small business and even make less. Better to not even bother with these people.
They are mostly dead on the inside, rotting with their lies and ego driven agendas.

Both the word corporation and corpse, as well as corporal and corpus callosum, among many other words with corp as their root, refer to a body, not to death. In the case of corporation, it means a single, legally recognized entity (body).

 

[Anonymous]

Both the word corporation and corpse, as well as corporal and corpus callosum, among many other words with corp as their root, refer to a body, not to death. In the case of corporation, it means a single, legally recognized entity (body).

still think corporation has a lot to do with death.

 

[Anonymous]

Isn't this the case with most corporate jobs?
The word corporation is derived from the word corpse, which refers to death.
Its all a joke.
Working for the corporation is the worst move anyone can make in their life. Better to make less and go non corporate. Better to start a small business and even make less. Better to not even bother with these people.
They are mostly dead on the inside, rotting with their lies and ego driven agendas.

I got what you mean. Yes, corpse literally translates to body; however it is usually used to refer to a dead body like a murdered one in a cops show. It's interesting to connect the two which is actually perfect.

Corporation- One big body of dead people! LoL

Yep! I totally get what you mean.

 

[Anonymous]

I have a suggestion. If a recruiter contacts you to ask you to interview. Ask if a contract management position is available in your area. They will sometimes submit you for an interview. It pays better and the position is much easier, less stressful if you are comfortable conducting business presentations, and obviously you'll receive a little more respect. They have interviewed reps for for contract positions in the past based on your experience.

 

[Anonymous]

I got what you mean. Yes, corpse literally translates to body; however it is usually used to refer to a dead body like a murdered one in a cops show. It's interesting to connect the two which is actually perfect.

Corporation- One big body of dead people! LoL

Yep! I totally get what you mean.

After 20 years, I can see what you mean.
The people I have met over the years are the most shallow and arrested in their development compared to my friends that don't work for corporations.

 

[Anonymous]

I know one male Pub. manager who was calling females who had applied for open positions and meeting with them at coffee shops for a non-interview. He met with some women for more than two hours. Sometimes he met with them more than once. He clarified that it was not an interview. He just wanted to meet for coffee to get to know them.
Of course, this manager is married.
Yuck!!

 

[Anonymous]

And they'll get vindictive If you show that you are not interested.

 

[Anonymous]

I know one male Pub. manager who was calling females who had applied for open positions and meeting with them at coffee shops for a non-interview. He met with some women for more than two hours. Sometimes he met with them more than once. He clarified that it was not an interview. He just wanted to meet for coffee to get to know them.
Of course, this manager is married.
Yuck!!

I know this one guy who sits at his keyboard trying to be the class clown. Everyone knows he's a tool.

 

[Anonymous]

I know this one guy who sits at his keyboard trying to be the class clown. Everyone knows he's a tool.

Sounds like 95% of all people in pharmaceuticals.
This industry is such a joke.

 

[Anonymous]

I'm not sure about the previous poster and what they were referring to regarding the three to four people; but a few other posters specifically mentioned that numbers are being manipulated. I've even heard this. When we compare numbers with partners and employees of the direct client, they don't match. I think many of us think that there is something wrong with altering numbers in ways that are dishonest. Why try to undermine a representative?

Also, claiming that representatives being let go are like "termites" or "weak links" is not always quite accurate. Let's be honest. If a client has issues that are not quite legitimate or above board, the disliked definitely appears to experience their numbers starting to head South. It doesn't help your case when district managers agree that they see this as well. Some of these low men/women on the totem pol have had pretty strong backgrounds with experience that many times does include management. It seems that these guys do deserve more respect. I've seen them get treated pretty disrespectfully.

Thoughtful post. You bring up two issues. First, nobody said all reps that are let go are like termites. When they become like termites they have to go. That is true of any organization or team effort. Raising concerns or suggesting alternative approaches does not in and of itself constitute a negative attitude. Far from. It demonstrates engagement. Approach matters, though. Your post demonstrates your recognition of that concept. The best way to be treated with respect is to be respectful. It is no guarantee, but it usually works that way.

Your concern is about the manipulation of numbers in a dishonest way. There are two parts to answering your question. First is the disconnect between your numbers and your counterparts. That can happen when there isn't exact mirroring of zip codes or accounts. It can also happen based on variations in weighting factors applied to managed care plans, or differences in goal calculation methods, or even differences in the way refills are handled. Different companies may take different approaches to measuring performance.

As for singling out certain representatives, that would never happen. Not because it could not be done, but because it would be counterproductive to evaluating overall performance. If territory numbers are altered, it means the district numbers would be impacted as well, and that would roll up to the region and nation. Nobody has time for that. Besides, what happens when reps change in the middle of a measurement period? Manipulating territory level data for one period would skew the territory performance for the next period. Compound that scenario for the entire sales team and the system would break down quickly.

Analysts see territories as individual components of districts, and districts as components of regions, and regions as components of the nation. They see a territory as a number, not as a person. DMs rarely have input in the process in any company, but they should know better than to suggest performance measurement is personal. It isn't.

It is never a good feeling to be down in the numbers, but plenty of well respected and well liked reps have been there. The best thing to do is understand your business and control what you can control. Same goes when you are on top, by the way. In our business, the more reps we have doing their best, the more opportunities we have to do this job. Every single rep makes a difference. Welcome to any applicant who knows this.

 

[Anonymous]

Applicants - please do be aware that the hriing manager may choose to share your email and phone number with other applicants.
This will happen before job offers are drafted.
Thus, it could casuse you to lose your current job when your name is circulated.

 

[Anonymous]

Applicants - please do be aware that the hriing manager may choose to share your email and phone number with other applicants.
This will happen before job offers are drafted.
Thus, it could casuse you to lose your current job when your name is circulated.

Ok, thanks for the heads up fuckface. That was amazingly informative!