Why isn't Biotronik doing better?

[Anonymous]

and to return to the original OP question ....

Why isn't Biotronik doing better?

I'll repost my answer from above:

I have answered that about 5 times since this thread started, so I'll answer itmagains and add one more wrinkle.

1) Lack of coverage
2) Soft market
3) No real desire to 'pay' the 'cost of switching".
4) Last to market with an EP focus - "They have a fine pacer, but do they even have a BiV?"

The new wrinkle is....we were last to have a Fellow's Program. You cannot underestimate the power of being in their hands as they are learning. The people they admire teach them the ropes, and those people use the Big 3. Who wants to learn a new product right out of Fellowship? You just want to lay low and stick to what you know for the first few years out...then you grow accustom to your local [Big 3 Company] team, and by the time you have the confidence and skills required to branch out - you just don't. It's amazing we even have 4%....that's why I consider the fact that I HAVE sold Bio devices as a true representation of my abilities.

 

[Anonymous]

I'll repost my answer from above:

I have answered that about 5 times since this thread started, so I'll answer itmagains and add one more wrinkle.

1) Lack of coverage
2) Soft market
3) No real desire to 'pay' the 'cost of switching".
4) Last to market with an EP focus - "They have a fine pacer, but do they even have a BiV?"

The new wrinkle is....we were last to have a Fellow's Program. You cannot underestimate the power of being in their hands as they are learning. The people they admire teach them the ropes, and those people use the Big 3. Who wants to learn a new product right out of Fellowship? You just want to lay low and stick to what you know for the first few years out...then you grow accustom to your local [Big 3 Company] team, and by the time you have the confidence and skills required to branch out - you just don't. It's amazing we even have 4%....that's why I consider the fact that I HAVE sold Bio devices as a true representation of my abilities.

Subject got boring that's why it switched.....now we're back to boring. ROI on Fellow's program proven to be worthless...made sense during the ICD "HAYDAYS" but new fellows are practicing concervative device approaches which works against what we do. Tapped out!!!

 

[Anonymous]

Subject got boring that's why it switched.....now we're back to boring. ROI on Fellow's program proven to be worthless...made sense during the ICD "HAYDAYS" but new fellows are practicing concervative device approaches which works against what we do. Tapped out!!!

Agree with the conservative part, but disagree that there is no point in having a Fellows Program. Whether Fellows enter a conservative practice or an aggressive one, they need to be exposed to our products along side our competitors during the Fellowship Phase of their training. It SUGGESTS that we are more like the Big 3 and less like Sorin.

 

[Anonymous]

Agree with the conservative part, but disagree that there is no point in having a Fellows Program. Whether Fellows enter a conservative practice or an aggressive one, they need to be exposed to our products along side our competitors during the Fellowship Phase of their training. It SUGGESTS that we are more like the Big 3 and less like Sorin.

That's a tall order and probably difficult to fill....but I can share with you one thing BIO can do, starting with reps and clinicals that could increase your business and certainly secure your changeouts.....deliver better service! This comment was made to me today by a very reasonable and forgiving EP for a major acct. He asked me if it was ok for him to give a BSX changeout to the BSX rep who has been servicing his acct eventhough they are not on contract. I said sure since the BSX rep is a good dude and has helped me out in the past. However, the EP vowed he would never extend that courtesy to BIO because they do not deliver basic service on past BIO devices he had implanted. If I worked for BIO I could turn him around tomorrow. That's how cool this EP is and for him to say that is very powerful and damaging to BIO's future with him.

I know BIO struggles with this stigma daily but you can never be compared to big 3 until you figure out how to fill this gap between sales and service. BIO will never score a big contract, which is the wave of our device business, unless they can convince the acct that they can service them as equally as the big 3. This brings the Fellows discussion back into view. Until BIO 100% commits to a service support program a Fellows program is a waste of $. A well trained Fellow on MDT product can put in BIO stuff tomorrow with no BIO product training no problem. I've seen it done. Developing a strong service program is the answer to BIO's present and future. What is the % of changeouts BIO gets on their own product versus competitors?

 

[Anonymous]

That's a tall order and probably difficult to fill....but I can share with you one thing BIO can do, starting with reps and clinicals that could increase your business and certainly secure your changeouts.....deliver better service! This comment was made to me today by a very reasonable and forgiving EP for a major acct. He asked me if it was ok for him to give a BSX changeout to the BSX rep who has been servicing his acct eventhough they are not on contract. I said sure since the BSX rep is a good dude and has helped me out in the past. However, the EP vowed he would never extend that courtesy to BIO because they do not deliver basic service on past BIO devices he had implanted. If I worked for BIO I could turn him around tomorrow. That's how cool this EP is and for him to say that is very powerful and damaging to BIO's future with him.

I know BIO struggles with this stigma daily but you can never be compared to big 3 until you figure out how to fill this gap between sales and service. BIO will never score a big contract, which is the wave of our device business, unless they can convince the acct that they can service them as equally as the big 3. This brings the Fellows discussion back into view. Until BIO 100% commits to a service support program a Fellows program is a waste of $. A well trained Fellow on MDT product can put in BIO stuff tomorrow with no BIO product training no problem. I've seen it done. Developing a strong service program is the answer to BIO's present and future. What is the % of changeouts BIO gets on their own product versus competitors?

Well, I am a Bio Rep and I have a volume commitment...so I can tell you that service is not a problem for my account. No layoffs. Just better service and much better pricing.

The story of your EP is part of the challenge of being a BIO rep. I accepted that there was a lot of bad blood out there, and took it on. The facts are, that I get paid higher commissions than my Big 3 counterparts. So, even if I dont get a thousand implants in a year, I will still make a livable wage with possibly some time left over for my family since I won't be in the lab 24/7. That was my theory - and so far that has been the practice. But again - your EP represents a challenge of perception.

To address that perception problem we have hired scores of new reps to fill those coverage gaps AND we implemented a Fellows Program. Of course a MDT Fellow can learn to use any product - as evidenced by the 41 years Biotronik survived without one. But, the problem is that newly minted EPs don't neccessarily want to use new products right out of the gate - PARTICULARLY Biotronik and Sorin who've they probably have heard so many negatives story's about. So, if you get a Fellows program - it gives our reps the chance to speak to them - interact - and hopefully leave an impression that will counter the myriad stories...like...your EP tells.

Finally, a Fellows Program helps us connect new Fellows looking for work to our customers who need EPs.

So, you and I will have to disagree on the Fellows program. I worked at the Big 3 with one, and saw it's worth. I came here and missed it. And now that we have one - I support it.

I miss being at the Big 3 for many reasons...but I think that in the emerging commoditized market we are well poised to survive and even thrive. Hell - the more you guys RIFF the more you start to look like.....us.

 

[Anonymous]

To answer your questions -

1. I get 100% of my BIO change-outs

2. I get 90-100% of my competitors change-outs

3. I get the vast majority of new implants from the group.

4. I've never paid a dime to my physicians.

5. In fact, when I do referral dinners with them, we split the bill 50/50.

6. My competitors at the big 3 refuse to do hospital checks for this office because they don't get "their" changeouts. Correction - St Jude will do hospital checks, MDT & BSX refuse to do them. They told one of the EPs to "call the BIO rep, they will do it." Just to let you all know - these competitive reps don't do checks in the office - the office has their own device tech - who has been trained on all the competitors products. In fact, the changeouts they are complaining about - they never got the initial implant - it was either done by a different physician or I did the initial implant when I was at one of the big 3.

7. I've never paid a dime to my physicians.

8. I have no accounts where there is a volume commitment on my part. All of my accounts are national contracts where there is either capitated pricing - ie, the same - for all vendors or it's open to all vendors.

9. I've never paid a dime to my physicians.

10. I'm not related nor is my spouse related to any of my physicians.

11. I have no side business deals with any of my customers.

I'm tired of listening to all the crap about BIO reps and the company's "reputation". My competitors from the big 3 are all either ex-nurses or ex-pharma reps. None of them can sell water to a dying man in the desert.

However, they are quite good at complaining to the cath labs about me though. I've had CCL techs tell me how they bad mouth me all day. What's funny is that they are bad mouthing me as they are either late to cases or have to call their CS's for extra product because they're short and the implanter has to wait.

I have my business because the physician trusts me for several reasons:
1. I show up for all checks / cases on time
2. I have my product
3. I know my product
4. I know my competitors product
5. I show up for all checks / cases on time
6. I understand the business of referral programs

Feel free to flame me.

 

[Anonymous]

"But again - your EP represents a challenge of perception."

It's not just a challenge of perception; as a high volume implanting physician (yes, we read these boards too!), I can tell you that the major reason I don't implant Biotronik is that the service is terrible and the local reps are utterly incompetent. Without exception, every single one of them cut their teeth with one of the "Big Three" and was either let go for lack of skills or ethics. Somehow they had no problem convincing Biotronik to hire them. From talking to my colleagues, I know this is true in other areas as well.

There may be locations where the Biotronik rep provides excellent service; some of the posters above sound like they do a great job. I've never seen it however.

Recognize that for 90% of implants, the devices are interchangeable widgets; they all do the same job and they all do it quite well. Local service is what differentiates the companies; if one company keeps pulling their reps from the bottom of the talent pool, they are never going to get much business.

 

[Anonymous]

"But again - your EP represents a challenge of perception."

It's not just a challenge of perception; as a high volume implanting physician (yes, we read these boards too!), I can tell you that the major reason I don't implant Biotronik is that the service is terrible and the local reps are utterly incompetent. Without exception, every single one of them cut their teeth with one of the "Big Three" and was either let go for lack of skills or ethics. Somehow they had no problem convincing Biotronik to hire them. From talking to my colleagues, I know this is true in other areas as well.

There may be locations where the Biotronik rep provides excellent service; some of the posters above sound like they do a great job. I've never seen it however.

Recognize that for 90% of implants, the devices are interchangeable widgets; they all do the same job and they all do it quite well. Local service is what differentiates the companies; if one company keeps pulling their reps from the bottom of the talent pool, they are never going to get much business.

Thank You....

 

[Anonymous]

This is the person who wrote post # 94.

I'm a little confused as to the hatred for independent reps. An independent rep and the sub-reps that come under the independent rep fall under the same guidelines - AdvaMed, etc. that direct reps for the big 3 fall under. The only difference between an independent rep and a direct rep is that the independent rep costs the company nothing - no salary, no benefits, nothing.

As an independent rep, I only make money when I sell something. To those who say this breeds an atmosphere of impropriety - I don't get it. If I'm unethical, and everyone finds out I'm unethical - then I won't sell anything - I won't make $1.

However, if I'm at the big 3 and I do something unethical, I still get my base salary ~ $65-$90k, my car allowance or company car (depending on the company) ~ $9-$12k / year, my health benefits (approx 20% of base pay - per the Society for Human Resources estimate of cost of benefits for an employee), and any 401k that I may have.

As a direct rep, I can be unethical and still make anywhere from $95-$125k in guaranteed income. This is between two-three times the median income in the US. As an independent rep, if I don't sell anything, then I need to donate blood to put food on the table.

Also, exactly why would a company want to eliminate its independent reps in order to move to a direct model? Independent reps are a firm cost - they cost whatever the commission rate happens to be. A direct rep costs significantly more than an independent. Based off of simple math, Biotronik wants to keep its independent sales force - they cost the company nothing.

As to the ethics of independent reps and Biotronik - remember, St Jude is still bringing on independent reps in certain situations, Johnson & Johnson has a large independent sales force for its orthopedic arm, Smith & Nephew has a large independent sales force, etc. It's been my experience that independent reps are older, more mature, and better sales reps than direct reps. I still remember the MADIT 2 expansion at Guidant and all the clowns that were brought on that never made it through training.

Yes, there are lousy Biotronik reps. Just as there are lousy Medtronic reps and lousy St Jude reps. Not too long ago, St Jude was a joke player in the ICD market with 10% national market share - 2004. It's sales reps were considered jokes. All of a sudden, Guidant has 40 recalls, its market share goes from 39% tachy (remember 2004 and the TWIN goals????) to 20% and St Jude goes from 10% to 29% virtually overnight. Did those St Jude sales reps suddenly become Zig Ziglar's???

The smart reps at the big 3 know that their companies are looking to cut territories and cut costs - they would rather lock up a 90% deal and have CS's cover cases for $80k than pay a rep commission on an account that a national account manager signed up. The smart reps realize that if they own their business - they will consider Biotronik because Biotronik still values sales reps for what they offer.

Biotronik isn't perfect, I could spend all day complaining, but ultimately, Biotronik pays me more for what is essentially a commodity product than BSC, MDT, or STJ could.

What's wrong with that? Isn't that the very nature of free agency and capitalism?

 

[Anonymous]

This is the person who wrote post # 94.

I'm a little confused as to the hatred for independent reps. An independent rep and the sub-reps that come under the independent rep fall under the same guidelines - AdvaMed, etc. that direct reps for the big 3 fall under. The only difference between an independent rep and a direct rep is that the independent rep costs the company nothing - no salary, no benefits, nothing.

As an independent rep, I only make money when I sell something. To those who say this breeds an atmosphere of impropriety - I don't get it. If I'm unethical, and everyone finds out I'm unethical - then I won't sell anything - I won't make $1.

However, if I'm at the big 3 and I do something unethical, I still get my base salary ~ $65-$90k, my car allowance or company car (depending on the company) ~ $9-$12k / year, my health benefits (approx 20% of base pay - per the Society for Human Resources estimate of cost of benefits for an employee), and any 401k that I may have.

As a direct rep, I can be unethical and still make anywhere from $95-$125k in guaranteed income. This is between two-three times the median income in the US. As an independent rep, if I don't sell anything, then I need to donate blood to put food on the table.

Also, exactly why would a company want to eliminate its independent reps in order to move to a direct model? Independent reps are a firm cost - they cost whatever the commission rate happens to be. A direct rep costs significantly more than an independent. Based off of simple math, Biotronik wants to keep its independent sales force - they cost the company nothing.

As to the ethics of independent reps and Biotronik - remember, St Jude is still bringing on independent reps in certain situations, Johnson & Johnson has a large independent sales force for its orthopedic arm, Smith & Nephew has a large independent sales force, etc. It's been my experience that independent reps are older, more mature, and better sales reps than direct reps. I still remember the MADIT 2 expansion at Guidant and all the clowns that were brought on that never made it through training.

Yes, there are lousy Biotronik reps. Just as there are lousy Medtronic reps and lousy St Jude reps. Not too long ago, St Jude was a joke player in the ICD market with 10% national market share - 2004. It's sales reps were considered jokes. All of a sudden, Guidant has 40 recalls, its market share goes from 39% tachy (remember 2004 and the TWIN goals????) to 20% and St Jude goes from 10% to 29% virtually overnight. Did those St Jude sales reps suddenly become Zig Ziglar's???

The smart reps at the big 3 know that their companies are looking to cut territories and cut costs - they would rather lock up a 90% deal and have CS's cover cases for $80k than pay a rep commission on an account that a national account manager signed up. The smart reps realize that if they own their business - they will consider Biotronik because Biotronik still values sales reps for what they offer.

Biotronik isn't perfect, I could spend all day complaining, but ultimately, Biotronik pays me more for what is essentially a commodity product than BSC, MDT, or STJ could.

What's wrong with that? Isn't that the very nature of free agency and capitalism?

You are only as good as the reputation of BIOTRNIK regardless of what you write or how you try to justify your existance in this industry. You are focused on the "small picture" and that's why you work for BIO....you NEVER hear a BIO rep talk about product superiority...it's all about me.... me..... me .....and what "I" make compared to what they made with the Big 3 and their newly found independence....you guys are ghosts......I only hear you...never see you....where are you?

 

[Anonymous]

To answer your questions -

1. I get 100% of my BIO change-outs

2. I get 90-100% of my competitors change-outs

3. I get the vast majority of new implants from the group.

4. I've never paid a dime to my physicians.

5. In fact, when I do referral dinners with them, we split the bill 50/50.

6. My competitors at the big 3 refuse to do hospital checks for this office because they don't get "their" changeouts. Correction - St Jude will do hospital checks, MDT & BSX refuse to do them. They told one of the EPs to "call the BIO rep, they will do it." Just to let you all know - these competitive reps don't do checks in the office - the office has their own device tech - who has been trained on all the competitors products. In fact, the changeouts they are complaining about - they never got the initial implant - it was either done by a different physician or I did the initial implant when I was at one of the big 3.

7. I've never paid a dime to my physicians.

8. I have no accounts where there is a volume commitment on my part. All of my accounts are national contracts where there is either capitated pricing - ie, the same - for all vendors or it's open to all vendors.

9. I've never paid a dime to my physicians.

10. I'm not related nor is my spouse related to any of my physicians.

11. I have no side business deals with any of my customers.

I'm tired of listening to all the crap about BIO reps and the company's "reputation". My competitors from the big 3 are all either ex-nurses or ex-pharma reps. None of them can sell water to a dying man in the desert.

However, they are quite good at complaining to the cath labs about me though. I've had CCL techs tell me how they bad mouth me all day. What's funny is that they are bad mouthing me as they are either late to cases or have to call their CS's for extra product because they're short and the implanter has to wait.

I have my business because the physician trusts me for several reasons:
1. I show up for all checks / cases on time
2. I have my product
3. I know my product
4. I know my competitors product
5. I show up for all checks / cases on time
6. I understand the business of referral programs

Feel free to flame me.

LIAR! You must work for one of the Big3 because none of your business practices match what BIO has built their reputation on. You must be known as the "Boy Scout" within BIO. Not believable however.

 

[Anonymous]

You are only as good as the reputation of BIOTRNIK regardless of what you write or how you try to justify your existance in this industry. You are focused on the "small picture" and that's why you work for BIO....you NEVER hear a BIO rep talk about product superiority...it's all about me.... me..... me .....and what "I" make compared to what they made with the Big 3 and their newly found independence....you guys are ghosts......I only hear you...never see you....where are you?

Fag!

 

[Anonymous]

You are only as good as the reputation of BIOTRNIK regardless of what you write or how you try to justify your existance in this industry. You are focused on the "small picture" and that's why you work for BIO....you NEVER hear a BIO rep talk about product superiority...it's all about me.... me..... me .....and what "I" make compared to what they made with the Big 3 and their newly found independence....you guys are ghosts......I only hear you...never see you....where are you?

"You are only as good as the reputation of Biotronik.."

So YOU'RE only as good as the reputation of Fidelis, Cognus or Riata? As you roll your eyes, let me demure by saying: No - our reputation as reps transcends what our companies do - otherwise none of us would have any business because ALL the companies have failed our customers.

What "small picture" are you referring to? The compensation? I'll admit - I was drawn in by that, but I was also tired of explaining BSX recalls, and confounded that we were using BIO leads. I figured, if the company I was working for was willing to stake it's reputation on one of it's competitors products - might as well cut out the middle man and go to the source.

Clearly this industry attracts some real genuine assholes, and I suspect given our size - ours tend to stand out a little more. I struggle with it anytime I'm calling on new accounts, so what you're describing is a challenge for me. Fortunately, I have turned a few customers around, and from them I can make a livable wage.

 

[Anonymous]

You are only as good as the reputation of BIOTRNIK regardless of what you write or how you try to justify your existance in this industry. You are focused on the "small picture" and that's why you work for BIO....you NEVER hear a BIO rep talk about product superiority...it's all about me.... me..... me .....and what "I" make compared to what they made with the Big 3 and their newly found independence....you guys are ghosts......I only hear you...never see you....where are you?

This is the person who wrote post 94 & 97.

I'm confused as to the reputation of Biotronik. Do you mean the reputation as the company that OEMs their leads to 2 competitors? Do you mean the reputation as the only company in the CRM industry that has never paid a fine to the DOJ for its marketing practices? Do you mean the reputation as the company that invented cellular home monitoring?

How am I focused on the "small" picture? By putting the word "small" in quotation marks are you implying irony? The irony is lost on me.

To me, the "small" picture is that my job as an independent rep allows me to pay my children's private school tuition.

To me, the "small" picture is that my job as an independent rep allows me to structure my income so that both myself and my wife max out our 401k contributions to our individual 401k I set up through my S-Corp.

To me, the "small" picture is that I have multiple product lines which allow me to broaden my customer base beyond just calling on electrophysiologists and cardiologists.

To me, the "small" picture is that I have a legal contract that delineates my territory for a fixed period of time. My manager cannot call me tomorrow and tell me that my main account is being given to a 24-year old fresh out of the pacing school that will make 1/3 of what I earn.

To your last point, "it's all about me.... me..... me .....and what "I" make compared to what they made with the Big 3 and their newly found independence".

Exactly what is wrong with that? Isn't that what Curt Flood fought for in 1969? Are we not allowed to act as rational beings and maximize our income? Our customers do it all the time. Is it okay for a physician to maximize his/her income but not a CRM sales rep? Is it okay for an equity trader to maximize his/her income but not a CRM sales rep? Is it okay for an attorney to maximize his/her income, but not a CRM sales rep?

The "big" picture is that having Biotronik & Sorin in the marketplace is good for sales representatives. Having more competition for talent drives up incomes. Having less competition for talent drives down incomes. In a somewhat free marketplace, the "Big 3" have to worry about their superstar reps leaving to go to Biotronik. Why do they worry? They worry because this market has been commoditized.

They worry that eventually, their smarter reps will realize that a pacemaker is a pacemaker, and why not work for someone who pays them more to sell essentially the same product. This is why the "Big 3" have so many recognition programs for reps - President's Club, Quarterly awards, etc. This is why they all have point programs with catalogs where reps can "purchase" prizes with "points" that are worthless. They do this because giving a rep the chance to win a $700 iPad costs less than paying that rep a larger commission rate.

Take away Biotronik and sales representatives are in an even worse situation when it comes to negotiating. If Biotronik left the CRM market, incomes across the industry would decrease. Medtronic, St Jude, and Boston Scientific would not have to compete for talent as readily.

I look at what people write here and say about Biotronik and laugh. I laugh when people say, "it's all about me.... me..... me ....." Isn't that what Ron Dollens said when made $100 million when Guidant was bought?

To quote Al Pacino - "You need people like me. You need people like me to point your finger at and say that's the bad guy."

Feel free to flame me.

 

[Anonymous]

This is the person who wrote post 94 & 97.

I'm confused as to the reputation of Biotronik. Do you mean the reputation as the company that OEMs their leads to 2 competitors? Do you mean the reputation as the only company in the CRM industry that has never paid a fine to the DOJ for its marketing practices? Do you mean the reputation as the company that invented cellular home monitoring?

How am I focused on the "small" picture? By putting the word "small" in quotation marks are you implying irony? The irony is lost on me.

To me, the "small" picture is that my job as an independent rep allows me to pay my children's private school tuition.

To me, the "small" picture is that my job as an independent rep allows me to structure my income so that both myself and my wife max out our 401k contributions to our individual 401k I set up through my S-Corp.

To me, the "small" picture is that I have multiple product lines which allow me to broaden my customer base beyond just calling on electrophysiologists and cardiologists.

To me, the "small" picture is that I have a legal contract that delineates my territory for a fixed period of time. My manager cannot call me tomorrow and tell me that my main account is being given to a 24-year old fresh out of the pacing school that will make 1/3 of what I earn.

To your last point, "it's all about me.... me..... me .....and what "I" make compared to what they made with the Big 3 and their newly found independence".

Exactly what is wrong with that? Isn't that what Curt Flood fought for in 1969? Are we not allowed to act as rational beings and maximize our income? Our customers do it all the time. Is it okay for a physician to maximize his/her income but not a CRM sales rep? Is it okay for an equity trader to maximize his/her income but not a CRM sales rep? Is it okay for an attorney to maximize his/her income, but not a CRM sales rep?

The "big" picture is that having Biotronik & Sorin in the marketplace is good for sales representatives. Having more competition for talent drives up incomes. Having less competition for talent drives down incomes. In a somewhat free marketplace, the "Big 3" have to worry about their superstar reps leaving to go to Biotronik. Why do they worry? They worry because this market has been commoditized.

They worry that eventually, their smarter reps will realize that a pacemaker is a pacemaker, and why not work for someone who pays them more to sell essentially the same product. This is why the "Big 3" have so many recognition programs for reps - President's Club, Quarterly awards, etc. This is why they all have point programs with catalogs where reps can "purchase" prizes with "points" that are worthless. They do this because giving a rep the chance to win a $700 iPad costs less than paying that rep a larger commission rate.

Take away Biotronik and sales representatives are in an even worse situation when it comes to negotiating. If Biotronik left the CRM market, incomes across the industry would decrease. Medtronic, St Jude, and Boston Scientific would not have to compete for talent as readily.

I look at what people write here and say about Biotronik and laugh. I laugh when people say, "it's all about me.... me..... me ....." Isn't that what Ron Dollens said when made $100 million when Guidant was bought?

To quote Al Pacino - "You need people like me. You need people like me to point your finger at and say that's the bad guy."

Feel free to flame me.

To quote the butler in the movie "Arthur" "You have a great economy with words, I anticipate your next syllable with great eagerness."

Sounds like you have spewwed your rap more than once.... well rehearsed...I am happy you are able to provide for yourself and family in the way that you claim but if that is all true, you speak for an extremly small % of BIO reps.

My previous reference of miopic business views is not a stab at deminishing you or your business, it simply points out that the 2 very large geographies I have worked in there is absolutely no BIO business happening...so I have to ask, where are you guys? I know you're out there.....but you have ZERO impact on me or my company.....so from my view, that's where the word "miopic" is truthfully employed. Of course you can carve out a piece of business somewhere and feed your family but you are one of the very few with that business model so you can only speak for yourself. Not as a successful, growing corporation with a bright future. By small #'s alone, your risk of recalls is small, if that's what you're afraid of, or choose as your argument...nuff said....I get it. BIO is a good model for you...you just can't speak for anyone else and my points have been on a much broader scale than just me or you, so I'm sorry you felt compelled to itemize them for the masses.

As to your minimizing remarks about the little corporate prizes, sales acknowledgments and rewards....I view them as resume enriching that add value to your future professional growth.

BIO chooses to fish in very small ponds that the Big 3 can't afford to waste their time in. So, to your point that the industry needs BIO, of course, "the world needs ditch diggers too" (Judge Schmelz to Danny-Caddy Shack)

Flamed! (past tense) Bar-B-Q'd

 

[Anonymous]

Actually, the DOJ announces the fine publicly. The company only issues a press release after the DOJ makes the announcement of the fine. The order of announcements is highly rehearsed.

Also, let's assume Biotronik is forced to pay a fine. What is the argument then?

Argument - "See, I told you Biotronik was dirty, they just paid a fine."

Reply - "Hasn't every other manufacturer of CRM devices paid a fine for its marketing practices in the past 5 years. Does that make them 'dirty' as well?"

Also, didn't Pfizer pay a fine of over $5 billion three years ago? Have physicians stopped prescribing Chantix, Celebrex, etc? Is Pfizer now a pariah company?

I'm not saying that its a good thing to pay a fine; however, using the logic of a DOJ investigation as evidence a company is corrupt is pretty weak. Every single firm in the CRM marketplace has been under both civil & criminal investigation (these investigations are always run concurrently when the DOJ investigates) in the past decade. Every single firm (with the exception of Biotronik) has paid a fine. When and if Biotronik is ordered to pay a fine - what makes that fine different than other companies fines?

The bottom line is that like in politics, everything is local. One simply cannot make a blanket statement and say all Medtronic reps are great, or all Biotronik reps are bad.

I'm sorry there is no Biotronik rep in your territory at the moment. However, to my earlier point, that is a good thing for you. When your company decides to arbitrarily cut your territory because you have become too powerful - ie, your customers like you too much, then you may want to consider Biotronik.

 

[Anonymous]

To quote the butler in the movie "Arthur" "You have a great economy with words, I anticipate your next syllable with great eagerness."

Sounds like you have spewwed your rap more than once.... well rehearsed...I am happy you are able to provide for yourself and family in the way that you claim but if that is all true, you speak for an extremly small % of BIO reps.

My previous reference of miopic business views is not a stab at deminishing you or your business, it simply points out that the 2 very large geographies I have worked in there is absolutely no BIO business happening...so I have to ask, where are you guys? I know you're out there.....but you have ZERO impact on me or my company.....so from my view, that's where the word "miopic" is truthfully employed. Of course you can carve out a piece of business somewhere and feed your family but you are one of the very few with that business model so you can only speak for yourself. Not as a successful, growing corporation with a bright future. By small #'s alone, your risk of recalls is small, if that's what you're afraid of, or choose as your argument...nuff said....I get it. BIO is a good model for you...you just can't speak for anyone else and my points have been on a much broader scale than just me or you, so I'm sorry you felt compelled to itemize them for the masses.

As to your minimizing remarks about the little corporate prizes, sales acknowledgments and rewards....I view them as resume enriching that add value to your future professional growth.

BIO chooses to fish in very small ponds that the Big 3 can't afford to waste their time in. So, to your point that the industry needs BIO, of course, "the world needs ditch diggers too" (Judge Schmelz to Danny-Caddy Shack)

Flamed! (past tense) Bar-B-Q'd

"My previous reference of miopic business views is not a stab at deminishing you or your business, it simply points out that the 2 very large geographies I have worked in there is absolutely no BIO business happening...so I have to ask, where are you guys? I know you're out there.....but you have ZERO impact on me..."

So, your "big" picture viewpoint is predicated on your experience in 2 geographies. Isn't that a little silly?

Do you think BIO remains in business on the 4% of the US Market alone?

 

[Anonymous]

Boy you two have some sexual tension, you obviously know who each other is. Why don't you just hook up again like that one night at HRS when their was too much Uzo and the wives went to bed early.

Front page Sunday NYTimes a picture of your device....Can't deny that!

This whole industry needs to lose the douchebags like you two and the other reps you represent. All of the reps from any company that make enough money to support five families on the backs of your CS. So you can pick a good wine and kiss ass, you really think the EP that uses the company whose product you pedal has any more integrity than you?

 

[Anonymous]

I think you may finally have your answer, or something close. By the end of 2012, they WILL be doing MUCH better. It will almost exclusively be on price. The perception of devices being generic has overshadowed the last five major GPO contracts I've been a part of. The real danger is one that nobody talks about; the vertical integration of the health care system. Watch this year how many of the Cardiology practices you service become wholly owned by the hospitals in which they practice. The choice will never "really" be taken away from the implanter, but the system will support those who play along.
It's all gonna change, and it's already started.

the link below is all pretty amazing, but the last 10 pages deserve particular attention:

http://www.courthousenews.com/2011/07/22/DocImplants.pdf

 

[Anonymous]

So after Biotronik claimed a programmer was malfunctioning and removed it? Never saw a bad programmer. Just bad progrmmer printers. Conspiracy sounds interesting.