Well, how much do you have in your 401K and how old are you?

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anonymous said:
its all a moot point, because the intellect on this website tells me that most of you are not smart enough to escape the soul trap that has snared out.

ok. back to the discussion.

the reason the 401k is a bad play is because during times of panic, people with cash make lots of money. however, if you money is tied up, you can't take advantage of the panic (see housing crisis in late 2000s and early 2010s). not only with real estate, but with stocks that are way undervalued.

another thing to consider is this: most rich people avoid taxes like the plague. there are ways to do it without tying up your money in a 401k. furthermore, there is nothing worse than needing cash, and not having access to your 401k, where you incur a 10 percent penalty for taking your money out. things happen in life, like divorce, illness, etc. its much better to be liquid, especially in these times, where sociopaths rule.
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Again, you prove you are a financial moron. Money in a 401k is meant to be used for retirement. It is not for speculation during market changes. If you don’t have extra dollars for investing in real estate or undervalued stocks outside of retirement funds, you shouldn’t be doing so. These are separate investments. As to your point on taxes, that is the primary benefit of a 401k. Portion under a Roth are mot taxes. Portions under a traditional 401k are tax deferred. Lastly, your point about a 10% penalty points out the idiocy of your first point. Further, you should first establish an emergency savings account PRIOR to putting money in retirement or any other investments so that you don’t need to pull money out of those accounts in the first place. You still need to retire. Taking money away from future needs doesn’t solve your problem. Having an emergency fund is like keeping insurance on your house or car.
 












UPDATED 4/15/19
AGE 55, NO KIDS, SINGLE
IRA BALANCE $935,000
TRUST INHERITANCE $950,000
401K $98,000
STOCKS $79,000
CHECKING ACCT $22,000
RETIREMENT TARGET AGE OF 58

UPDATED 6/23/20
AGE 56, NO KIDS, SINGLE
IRA BALANCE $1,071,000
TRUST INHERITANCE $1,373,000
401K $134,000
STOCKS $138,400
CHECKING ACCT $29,000
RETIREMENT TARGET AGE: RETIRED JUNE 2020
(INVESTED IN VOLATILE TECHNOLOGY MUTUAL FUNDS FOR 30 YEARS)

UPDATED 4/1/21
AGE 57, NO KIDS, SINGLE
IRA BALANCE $1,440,000
STOCKS AND MUTUAL FUNDS $2,004,000
401K $176000
CHECKING ACCT $28,000
RETIRED JUNE 2020
P.S. - COVID SUCKS!

UPDATED 2/9/2023
AGE 58.5, NO KIDS, SINGLE
IRA BALANCE $1,378,000
STOCK AND MUTUAL FUNDS $1,667,000
401K - MOVED $176K INTO IRA ABOVE
CHECKING ACCT $10,000
NO MORTGAGE
RETIRED JUNE 2020
I GOT CRUSHED IN 2021 LIKE MOST PEOPLE BUT AM STAYING THE COURSE BEING
IN VOLATILE TECH. MUTUAL FUNDS AND CONSUMER DISC. FUNDS
 






UPDATED 4/15/19
AGE 55, NO KIDS, SINGLE
IRA BALANCE $935,000
TRUST INHERITANCE $950,000
401K $98,000
STOCKS $79,000
CHECKING ACCT $22,000
RETIREMENT TARGET AGE OF 58

UPDATED 6/23/20
AGE 56, NO KIDS, SINGLE
IRA BALANCE $1,071,000
TRUST INHERITANCE $1,373,000
401K $134,000
STOCKS $138,400
CHECKING ACCT $29,000
RETIREMENT TARGET AGE: RETIRED JUNE 2020
(INVESTED IN VOLATILE TECHNOLOGY MUTUAL FUNDS FOR 30 YEARS)

UPDATED 4/1/21
AGE 57, NO KIDS, SINGLE
IRA BALANCE $1,440,000
STOCKS AND MUTUAL FUNDS $2,004,000
401K $176000
CHECKING ACCT $28,000
RETIRED JUNE 2020
P.S. - COVID SUCKS!

UPDATED 5/16/2023
AGE 59, NO KIDS, SINGLE
IRA BALANCE $1,473,000
STOCK AND MUTUAL FUNDS $1,712,000
MOVED 401K BALANCE INTO IRA ACCT
CHECKING ACCT $35,000
NO MORTGAGE
RETIRED JUNE 2020
I GOT CRUSHED IN 2021 LIKE MOST PEOPLE BUT AM STAYING THE COURSE BEING
IN VOLATILE TECH. MUTUAL FUNDS, CONSUMER DISC. FUNDS AND LARGE GROWTH FUNDS
 












anonymous said:
The 401k is easily one of the worst investments.

If you can't figure out why, then you need to get a new life calculator.
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Somebody has mentioned this in this forum, I think.
But, its true for many reasons.
The biggest has to do with the future value of money. There are calculations that can be done to prove this to be correct.
Also, there are fees associated with holding a 401k, that do not benefit the person.
Perhaps more important is the idea that nothing can go wrong for 30-40 years or so or the length of time you have a 401k.
Especially in such a flakey industry like pharmaceutical and medical, where you can get downsized even if you are a top performer. Its odd, but true.
In my opinion, allowing any individual or institution to hold your money is stupid. At least with real estate, you have some control over your investments. And with great options like AirBNB these days, buying property is a great investment. This is even more true if you have handyman skills.
 






The truth is this:

People that throw their hard earned money into a 401k have no clue about investing.

Nothing wrong with that, but its quite irresponsible. Especially since you have take that hard earned money and get greater returns. Examples include starting up a side business with that capital, investing in land or real estate when people are cash strapped and will accept your deals (this is true right now with high interest rates), and cash is king again.

Hate to break it to your corporate guys (I was one for 20 years and not proud of it), but there is far more cash available in things like buying and selling junk. I know of a man that started a company on the buy and sell of used surgical equipment and retired at a very early age after he sold it.

But, keep at that corporate job. Its all the most of you know.

Just don't let it take too much of your soul away, as it probably already has.
 






anonymous said:
The 401k is easily one of the worst investments.

If you can't figure out why, then you need to get a new life calculator.
Click to expand...


You are a moron. A 401k is not an investment. It is merely the tax treatment. The investment is what is inside the 401k. It can be good or bad depending on what options are available. If you are too stupid to know how to pick out good investment options for your 401k, then you should even be managing your money and should find someone that actually knows what they are doing.
 






anonymous said:
The truth is this:

People that throw their hard earned money into a 401k have no clue about investing.

Nothing wrong with that, but its quite irresponsible. Especially since you have take that hard earned money and get greater returns. Examples include starting up a side business with that capital, investing in land or real estate when people are cash strapped and will accept your deals (this is true right now with high interest rates), and cash is king again.

Hate to break it to your corporate guys (I was one for 20 years and not proud of it), but there is far more cash available in things like buying and selling junk. I know of a man that started a company on the buy and sell of used surgical equipment and retired at a very early age after he sold it.

But, keep at that corporate job. Its all the most of you know.

Just don't let it take too much of your soul away, as it probably already has.
Click to expand...

A 401k is a way to invest for retirement. It is one of the few tax breaks available and if the plan has good options available, is a reliable way to secure all of your retirement needs. Saying otherwise shows that you have no clue as to what you are talking about.

Investing in a business, buying real estate, etc should be done with after tax dollars. The goal of this type of investing is for building wealth. It has higher risk (of course higher potential reward), so it should not be your sole way of investing for retirement. If you do not have money to do both, you should not be investing in a business or real estate as you can’t afford to do so. Instead, work another job until you have sufficient capital for a business and/or real estate.
 






Most smarter people hardly pay taxes.
You can figure that out, since you are so smart.

401k is bad for too many reasons I have listed, but the one I hate the most is allowing another person (and paying that person a percentage) to hold MY money for an extended period of time.

Also, you might be in a lower tax bracket when you take your money out of a 401k, but you still have to pay taxes on that money, eventually.

It's not my fault you don't know how to grow wealth. Instead, you trust these "experts" to handle what you have worked for.
 






anonymous said:
Most smarter people hardly pay taxes.
You can figure that out, since you are so smart.

401k is bad for too many reasons I have listed, but the one I hate the most is allowing another person (and paying that person a percentage) to hold MY money for an extended period of time.

Also, you might be in a lower tax bracket when you take your money out of a 401k, but you still have to pay taxes on that money, eventually.

It's not my fault you don't know how to grow wealth. Instead, you trust these "experts" to handle what you have worked for.
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Everyone that makes significant money eventually pays taxes. It comes down to how long you can defer paying those taxes. Or course you don’t really have to worry about it given the minor amount you actually earn.

As to a 401K, if you put it in a Roth 401K, you are only paying tax on the company match.

I suggest you find someone to help you manage what little money you have given your lack of knowledge.
 






Maximizing your 401K in a good index fund keeps costs low and insures a successful retirement. The market will always outpace inflation and there has never been a failed 30 year period. With that as an insurance policy, you have the ability to take risk in other investments without the worry of a failed retirement.

401k’s have a contribution limit of $22,500 ($30,000 for those 50 and over). If you only have enough to invest at or below this maximum, you do not have enough free cash flow to be investing in more risk assets and you need to have your focus on boosting your income.
 






401k is arguably the greatest scam put forth by the Rich.

If you can't understand that, then have fun with your 1-2M that you labored for.

Most truly intelligent business people will take their cash flow and put it into action and not park it into a 401k. No way. I have talked to too many people that laugh at the 401k, people that are worth closer to 10-50M. They made their money by investing in businesses.

Carry on.
 






anonymous said:
401k is arguably the greatest scam put forth by the Rich.

If you can't understand that, then have fun with your 1-2M that you labored for.

Most truly intelligent business people will take their cash flow and put it into action and not park it into a 401k. No way. I have talked to too many people that laugh at the 401k, people that are worth closer to 10-50M. They made their money by investing in businesses.

Carry on.
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And you would be wrong. First of all, we have plenty of data to see that the majority of tax benefits from 401Ks, IRA’s, etc. are realized by the top 10%. There are few tax shelters, and the wealthy use this, amongst others. Second, if your cash flow is impacted to any material extent from putting money in a 401K, you are not wealthy. Just look at the annual limits. Even with the catch up provision, you are limited to $30k a year. That is barely a rounding error for someone with a net worth of 10- 50 million, showing how stupid your comment really is. Third, you are not actually putting your money into a 401K. The 401k refers to the tax treatment. Money invested, goes into funds. If you then roll it over into a self directed IRA, you can then invest it much more broadly (individual stocks, etc.). Some will go to the extent of investing in real estate with an IRA (which can be a bit complicated).

Each time you look like a fool when you post. Why don’t you just stick to putting your money into beanie babies. I am sure your financial outcome will be similar to your current path of poverty.
 






anonymous said:
And you would be wrong. First of all, we have plenty of data to see that the majority of tax benefits from 401Ks, IRA’s, etc. are realized by the top 10%. There are few tax shelters, and the wealthy use this, amongst others. Second, if your cash flow is impacted to any material extent from putting money in a 401K, you are not wealthy. Just look at the annual limits. Even with the catch up provision, you are limited to $30k a year. That is barely a rounding error for someone with a net worth of 10- 50 million, showing how stupid your comment really is. Third, you are not actually putting your money into a 401K. The 401k refers to the tax treatment. Money invested, goes into funds. If you then roll it over into a self directed IRA, you can then invest it much more broadly (individual stocks, etc.). Some will go to the extent of investing in real estate with an IRA (which can be a bit complicated).

Each time you look like a fool when you post. Why don’t you just stick to putting your money into beanie babies. I am sure your financial outcome will be similar to your current path of poverty.
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Disagree.

That 1-3 M in you silly 401k over 25-35 years, is easily 5-10M or more if invested properly.

Don't get mad at me for showing you and others a better route that you were to lazy to investigate.

I guess that is what is comes down to: The 401k is a lazy investment, while exploring market opportunities with cash on hand is an investment for thinking people that like to work.
 






anonymous said:
Disagree.

That 1-3 M in you silly 401k over 25-35 years, is easily 5-10M or more if invested properly.

Don't get mad at me for showing you and others a better route that you were to lazy to investigate.

I guess that is what is comes down to: The 401k is a lazy investment, while exploring market opportunities with cash on hand is an investment for thinking people that like to work.
Click to expand...

Not only are you a financial moron, you can’t even reading comprehension problem. You are currently limited to $22,500 a year in contributions ($30,000/yr if you are 50 or older). If these levels have any material impact on your cash flows, then you don’t have the financial ability to invest in anything more substantial. These levels are not even a rounding error for the wealthy. Further, you demonstrated your lack of knowledge when you don’t even look at the data as to whom currently benefits the most from 401K tax advantages (it is the wealthy).

Poor people like you obviously don’t understand what rich people REALLY do.
 






anonymous said:
401k is arguably the greatest scam put forth by the Rich.

If you can't understand that, then have fun with your 1-2M that you labored for.

Most truly intelligent business people will take their cash flow and put it into action and not park it into a 401k. No way. I have talked to too many people that laugh at the 401k, people that are worth closer to 10-50M. They made their money by investing in businesses.

Carry on.
Click to expand...


Perhaps you should have done a little research before making such a stupid post. Take a look at what percentage of wealth is tied up in 401ks and IRAs by HNWI (high net worth individuals). Take a look at what percentage of tax benefits from 401Ks and IRAs go to HNWIs.
 






anonymous said:
Perhaps you should have done a little research before making such a stupid post. Take a look at what percentage of wealth is tied up in 401ks and IRAs by HNWI (high net worth individuals). Take a look at what percentage of tax benefits from 401Ks and IRAs go to HNWIs.
Click to expand...

It is not a stupid post.
You don't understand money and future values, etc.
 












anonymous said:
61 years Old,

Investments 3 million Net worth about 3.6 million, no debt except $210,000 on the mortgage..

Still not sure if i can retire since I live on the West Coast
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You are like a child or are lying.

Some of you on here are really just lost in life.

If you can't retire on a significant amount of money, you have some personal problems, a crazy spouse, or a drug habit.
 






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