Ethicon vs Applied Medical

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Ahahaha. You guys crack me up. Just like an Ethicon rep to start stuffing things up asses. Why are you so pissed?

Tell me, what are you selling that's providing a better outcome? The Xcel? Dextrus? Ha? How about you try to come up with something new that will actually benefit the patient, rather than license an idea off someone else and call it your own (i.e. Applied).

And as far as going public, why bother? To raise money? Naa...Applied just keep licensing their technology to bumbling idiots like Ethicon, and suing companies like Covidean for stealing.
 




Anonymous said:
Ahahaha. You guys crack me up. Just like an Ethicon rep to start stuffing things up asses. Why are you so pissed?

Tell me, what are you selling that's providing a better outcome? The Xcel? Dextrus? Ha? How about you try to come up with something new that will actually benefit the patient, rather than license an idea off someone else and call it your own (i.e. Applied).

And as far as going public, why bother? To raise money? Naa...Applied just keep licensing their technology to bumbling idiots like Ethicon, and suing companies like Covidean for stealing.
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Yawn. Sounds like you are a great rep. Why don't you come into my territory because I need the Applied challenge. So far, 5 evaluations from the "superior" Applied trocars and so far, 5 evaluations that failed within 2 weeks.

I don't know how many surgeons will do it though, they'll continue to suffer with the XCEL trocars. I hope that somehow they still can perform their lap. procedures with such inferior products.

I guess all of the lies that I learned in training really helped me out.

It probably wasn't the fact that at all 5 evaluations, the Applied rep was busted filling out false evaluation forms. Here's an idea, if your reps are that hard up to make these evaluations work for you, don't let the surgeons see the final evaluation forms/excel spreadsheets that you give to the OR managers during the evals. When a surgeon sees that even though he/she gave a "negative/clinically unacceptable" response on the form and somehow, it miraculously is a positive response after it is turned into the OR manager by the Applied rep, the surgeon really respond to that in a positive manner.

Maybe at your training seminars, they can teach the reps to smarter with their tactics?

The funny thing about these evaluations was the same Applied rep tried to falsify documents at all five accounts that are within a two hour radius. Do you honestly think that the OR managers don't talk to each other at these local hospitals?

Oh well..back to the grind.
 




Hey 9:42- The reason it would be nice for them to go public is so the people who have been there a while can actually make some REAL money for their efforts. Applied is sooo cheap! Making two people share a room at a sales meeting,come on its not a high school field trip. Great spots for the Nat'l sales meetings....Is this years going to be on the outskirts of Dallas? Or are you going all out and having it in Cleveland? Keep paying bullshit expenses and fucking with the comp plan and the revolving door will keep spinng..Maybe the engineers can figure out a way to harness the energy of the door to power the home office and you can actually go to some place decent for a meeting with all the money you save.
 




Anonymous said:
Ahahaha. You guys crack me up. Just like an Ethicon rep to start stuffing things up asses. Why are you so pissed?

Tell me, what are you selling that's providing a better outcome? The Xcel? Dextrus? Ha? How about you try to come up with something new that will actually benefit the patient, rather than license an idea off someone else and call it your own (i.e. Applied).

And as far as going public, why bother? To raise money? Naa...Applied just keep licensing their technology to bumbling idiots like Ethicon, and suing companies like Covidean for stealing.
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You guys do realize that your interacting with an Applied rep? An Applied rep!? Can you imagine what your day entails if you work for Applied? How many times can you tell the same surgeon about a trocar? How many times are you going to talk to someone about hand assist colectomies with a handport? How many times can you talk about your "dry lubricant" in your trocar? That would be like going out in the field and talking about nothing but a linear cutter for weeks on end. At least EES has the opportunity to sell other non commodity products like Contour, Focus, ACE, Echelon or Synergy.

I can't imagine what life would be like just selling a friggin trocar all day. Especially when the market is so oversaturated with Covidien, Conmed, Taut, etc. It is a commodity, nothing more, nothing less.

I think EES reps are more concerned about reprocessing than Applied.
 




Anonymous said:
Hey 9:42- The reason it would be nice for them to go public is so the people who have been there a while can actually make some REAL money for their efforts. Applied is sooo cheap! Making two people share a room at a sales meeting,come on its not a high school field trip. Great spots for the Nat'l sales meetings....Is this years going to be on the outskirts of Dallas? Or are you going all out and having it in Cleveland? Keep paying bullshit expenses and fucking with the comp plan and the revolving door will keep spinng..Maybe the engineers can figure out a way to harness the energy of the door to power the home office and you can actually go to some place decent for a meeting with all the money you save.
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What's good about the revolving door, is it filters out the shit.

This is just hilarious. All I hear on this board is Me Me Me Me Me. I want my own room. I want a meeting in a cool city. I want more money for sitting on my ass and doing nothing. My god. Are you serious.


Can you imagine what your day entails if you work for Applied?
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Hmmm, I don't know....why don't you ask half the team who came from EES?
 




Anonymous said:
Hey 9:42- The reason it would be nice for them to go public is so the people who have been there a while can actually make some REAL money for their efforts. Applied is sooo cheap! Making two people share a room at a sales meeting,come on its not a high school field trip. Great spots for the Nat'l sales meetings....Is this years going to be on the outskirts of Dallas? Or are you going all out and having it in Cleveland? Keep paying bullshit expenses and fucking with the comp plan and the revolving door will keep spinng..Maybe the engineers can figure out a way to harness the energy of the door to power the home office and you can actually go to some place decent for a meeting with all the money you save.
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What's good about the revolving door, is it filters out the shit.

This is just hilarious. All I hear on this board is Me Me Me Me Me. I want my own room. I want a meeting in a cool city. I want more money for sitting on my ass and doing nothing. My god. Are you serious.


Can you imagine what your day entails if you work for Applied?
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Why don't you ask half the team who came from EES?
 












Having worked for both, I would lean toward the Applied option if you want a challenging job. You actually have to sell your stuff. EES is more of an account manager position and the contracts sell your stuff for you. I have not seen one hospital convert from Applied to EES but I have seen numerous accounts switch from EES to Applied. Trocars are a commodity item and there is not one account out there that can't save money by using Applied. Again, Applied challenging and EES not so much. Applied less money better culture. EES more money, less skill required, and so-so culture. With the way that Applied operates corporately, it may be the better choice in this economy.
 




Been with applied 1 year. Not an easy job, have had products break during surgery. But on the flip side, have seen other products break as well (ees, covidien).

Personally I don't think that reps should have as much influence in hospitals. Most companies sell commodity products. Products like gelport and alexis are niche and help in surgery but are not needed.

Applied Reps are trained to be aggressive and piss off many admin heads, but the back intention is to make money and to save the hospital money. A good guy in disguise.

The other 2 are typical corporate companies. They have great perks, pay, but give it good to the hospitals.

Personally I can see how ees and covidien is better for the rep. However Applied takes on a collectivist approach. "the sum of the whole is greater than the individual part." - Even if most parts are broken.
 




Tom-

It sounds to me that you aren't really cut out for this industry regardless of the company. You should try getting a job at a university in some place like Berlkey. That way you can get paid for never taking personal responsibilty for anything, hugging trees, and pointing out the flaws of all the people that are willing to sell aggressively to win the business. Products break. Get over it or get gone.
 




Anonymous said:
When you compare product to products, Applied is so much further ahead, it's not even funny.

Take the Xcel. 3 years to design, and it still incorporates Applied's seal technology??? C'mon. In 3 years, Applied will release a seal better than Xcel, improve upon it, then obsolete it because they have an even newer one!

Ethicon can't sell the benefits of their product, so they have to make things up. You Eth reps know what I'm talking about because it's part of your training.

I agree, do your homework, and it'll be crystal clear.
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Where do you get your information?? XCEL does not incorporate any technology from Applied, that is a blatant lie. As far as Applied reps being better at selling the benefits of their products? Maybe true if you are talking about the cost of their products - funny how the more "advanced" the trocar becomes, the more expensive it gets. What about that funnel lead-in that Applied just adapted? Gets more like XCEL every time. Ethicon reps beat Applied reps in a clinical sale any day.
 




Anonymous said:
Where do you get your information?? XCEL does not incorporate any technology from Applied, that is a blatant lie.
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Ha. Are you kidding me. (http://www.appliedmed.com/events/article_detail.aspx?fileName=13.htm) Did you ever wonder (probably not), why the seal is in two pieces? There's no clinical benefit to that. It's because of the royalty agreement.

Applied get's paid for the universal seal design from both Ethicon and Covidien. At least with Ethicon, Applied gets paid legally through a license agreement. Covidien has to be sued for stealing the design.
 




Heard they gave a few of the tenured reps a clock for their years of service at a zone meeting last Saturday. Way to go big spenders. These guys give you years of under paid service and you give them a $30 clock!. Way to go.
 








Anonymous said:
When you compare product to products, Applied is so much further ahead, it's not even funny.

Take the Xcel. 3 years to design, and it still incorporates Applied's seal technology??? C'mon. In 3 years, Applied will release a seal better than Xcel, improve upon it, then obsolete it because they have an even newer one!


With the quote above in mind, could the Applied reps that are trolling the Ethicon site please answer the following questions for me...

1. If Applied has such a clinical superior trocar, why do you have to sell on price? Why can't you sell the clinical benefits of your trocar to defeat a Ethicon or Covidien trocar?

2. If your trocar is so superior, why do you have to approach materials managers first instead of getting clinical support from the surgeons to initiate a trial? If the product is so superior, why don't surgeons request it at hospitals and demand a trial of the product?

I doubt I'll get an answer to these questions but I figured that I would ask anyways.
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Anonymous;2615253 1. If Applied has such a clinical superior trocar said:
Why is it when products evolve and improve, the price has to go up? Isn't it supposed to be the other way around? It is in every other industry. What's interesting is how Applied can manufacture all their products in the US, and price them lower than Ethicon which has to manufacture overseas. Way to go with the Xcel. Improve the seal design over the old one, tell the customer the old one is not available, oh, and by the way, this new one is going to cost you 30% more.

We can talk about clinical benefits of a trocar all day long. Let's start with the benefits of the seal....oh wait, that was designed by Applied. It's not about going to the MM first, it's about getting everyone involved, not paying a surgeon to use your products and cramming it down everyone elses throat at the hospital.

Do you even know how to initiate a trial? A surgeon won't initiate it. Take a page from the Applied model and you might get some market share back....or at least learn something.
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Anonymous said:
Heard they gave a few of the tenured reps a clock for their years of service at a zone meeting last Saturday. Way to go big spenders. These guys give you years of under paid service and you give them a $30 clock!. Way to go.
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You know, you're right. That does suck. Years of service and a lousy clock. What the hell are they thinking. And how dare they pair reps up in hotel rooms at trade shows and meetings. What the hell is that all about? Don't they deserve to have their own? And why have a meeting in a stupid place like Burnt Scrotum, New Mexico? My god! Really? How in the hell are you supposed to party after it's done?

You guys are nothing but a bunch of whinning kids. It's me, me, me, me, me. Do you think Ethicon absorbs the cost of all those expenses? Hell no. No business would in their right mind! You pass it off to the customer. I'm sure the customer is happy to pay for a more expensive trocar so that you can have your own room at a meeting in Fort Lauderdale where you get your rolex watch for 2 years of service.
 












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