EBI v. Exogen

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Hey,

DJO you seem to be making a killing with your 8/9 thousand a month... thats about a third of what I do a month in bone stim alone. What that should teach you is that the market is huge have you ever wondered how we all stay in business? When a dumb rep comes he they get washed out and that is a windfall for whatever hardworking rep is in the territory, it really has little to do with the product BECAUSE THEY ALL WORK, which is unfortunate since I would make much more if everyone patients didn't heal but mine.

have a great day everyone
 












Anonymous said:
I'll gladly defend that. The meta-analysis included only PEMF and CC bone stim. No CMF was involved in any of the studies that they looked at.

Different signal, different results.
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Nice try. Did you actually conclude this after reading the meta-analysis? Here is what the authors clearly stated:

"We searched four electronic databases (MEDLINE, EMBASE, CINAHL, and all Evidence-Based Medicine Reviews) for trials of electromagnetic stimulation and bone repair, in any language, published from the inception of the database to April 2008. In addition, we searched by hand seven relevant journals published between 1980 and April 2008 and the bibliographies of eligible trials."

"Of 2546 citations obtained in the literature search, eleven articles met the inclusion criteria."


11 out of 2546 met their criteria! That means that all of the CMF studies stunk and were not included. So if its not good enough for JBJS, its junk.

There is nothing you can counter except to say that the authors were negligent in their search and good luck with that. JBJS is as good as it gets in the USA.
 






I am convinced that ater reading this entire post that all of you sound like a bunch of high school dropouts. What's with the language and knock downs. I would not hire any of you to rep for me. Grow up people.
 






Anonymous said:
I am convinced that ater reading this entire post that all of you sound like a bunch of high school dropouts. What's with the language and knock downs. I would not hire any of you to rep for me. Grow up people.
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This is an anonymous board. This does not mean that we act like "high school dropouts" with physicians. You have to be high to believe that.
 






Anonymous said:
First off, all Bone Growth stimulators work, it's the time of treatment that differs. Compliance is obviously higher with shorter treatment times.

Exogen, hands down is the better of the two, but, EBI has the insurance coverage wrapped up which is what really matters in the end. You can have the greatest device in the world but if you can't get it paid for what good is it? Patients aren't going to pay out of pocket for something as pricey as a bone growth stimulator - co-pays are high enough as it is.
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If copays are as high as $700 and anyone really cared, they'd rent the product for $70 per month. Aren't healing times less than ten months?
 






Anonymous said:
Boys and girls. I'm making 8-9 grand a month off of a zero based teritory selling those "junk" DJO bone stimes. On the long bone side only.

The job is about relationship building. Some Exogen skank with big tits, and an EBI rep thats about 45 years old arent exactly the toughest competition.

Our product was cleared with the most rigorous double-blind study in the bone-stim field. Post-market data has proven our heal rates to be favorable to Exogen, EBI, Ofix, etc...

Keep talking, bitching about how DJO's product is garbage, and I'll keep taking your accounts, building my business.

Want me to lube up when I drive my S class up your ass?

Thanks.
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According to the suit just filed, you may have to drive it to jail.
 






Anonymous said:
Hey,

DJO you seem to be making a killing with your 8/9 thousand a month... thats about a third of what I do a month in bone stim alone. What that should teach you is that the market is huge have you ever wondered how we all stay in business? When a dumb rep comes he they get washed out and that is a windfall for whatever hardworking rep is in the territory, it really has little to do with the product BECAUSE THEY ALL WORK, which is unfortunate since I would make much more if everyone patients didn't heal but mine.

have a great day everyone
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Looks like the subpoenas issued in the whistleblower suit asks for records back 15 yrs. for the bone stims..you have a great day too
 












Anonymous said:
If copays are as high as $700 and anyone really cared, they'd rent the product for $70 per month. Aren't healing times less than ten months?
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There you go on your "Rental Tirade". Not all DME is rentable. These machines are fairly complex with ultrasound or electrical components. They are not like wheelchairs.
Besides, they are not "routinely" prescribed.

I agree, however, that co-pays are Way too High.
 






DJO's efficacy rate is pretty pathetic. Looked it up on your own website. 60.7% is pretty pathetic. Why would a surgeon even bother to waste a patient's money on this junk.

Exogen's overall efficacy is 86%....quite a difference.
 






DJO's efficacy rate is pretty pathetic. Looked it up on your own website. 60.7% is pretty pathetic. Why would a surgeon even bother to waste a patient's money on this junk.

Exogen's overall efficacy is 86%....quite a difference.
 






DJO's efficacy rate is pretty pathetic. Looked it up on your own website. 60.7% is pretty pathetic. Why would a surgeon even bother to waste a patient's money on this junk.

Exogen's overall efficacy is 86%....quite a difference.
 












Maybe in your territory your competition is on maternity leave. Check out the company reports for all the stim companies and you will find the revenue they all bring quarterly. You can then figure out the markershares for each product and see who really brings it.
 






Anyone who thinks a patient would rather wear a unit for 10 hours a day (Biomet) and get a 63% healing rate over an Exogen is an absolute moron. The Exogen is 20 minutes per day with an 86% success rate. The depth of penetration is 26.5 cm or 10.5 inches for those of you who struggle with conversion rates. Also, the Exogen ultrasound beam expands 2.5x the width of the transducer (the black thing). Anyone who thinks the 1970's technology of the Biomet bone stim is superior to the Exogen is seriously kidding themselves, or is easily fooled buy absolute garbage.

Techman
 






As a recent user of the Exogen who is looking for information about it's price ($4500.00 billed to my insurance company!!!!), I am really amazed at what I have just read. First, I don't think my ortho knew the Exogen could be used on fresh fractures and I had to wait 90 days in an uncomfortable boot to get the unit. As for how well it works, I don't know whether it was just time for the fracture (base of the 5th met) to heal, or the addition of supplements to my diet, or the unit itself that helped promote the healing. But that's not my issue right now. I'm a physical therapist and what really appalls me is the lack of professionalism between these sales reps. Especially the one claiming to be so successful because one of the competing reps was a whole 45 years old. I have to tell you that 45 is actually young.
Thank you for educating me as to what the reps are really concerned about. Not the patient. That's obvious. It's all about the money, fancy cars, market share and who can smooze the doctors better. I find this all really sad and now understand why the unit cost so much. I'm sure there's at least $100.00 worth of equipment in that package. But to charge $4500.00 is pure insanity. I'm aware through my own practice what the mark up is on medical equipment. You've all given me a whole new dislike of equipment reps. It was a good education. For that I thank you. For your high and mighty attitudes - I send you my sympathy. The day will come when you will be a patient just looking for help and on the other side of your doctor will be a sales rep in his fancy suit, carrying his expensive leather briefcase and driving his prestigious car. Next time pretend you're selling something your mother or father will be using. And remember, just a little humility goes a long way. In the meantime I'm going to print off all the foul garbage you've been spewing at each other and give it to every ortho whose patients I treat. I think they'll get a kick out of your true
motivation. Don't you?
 






Anonymous said:
As a recent user of the Exogen who is looking for information about it's price ($4500.00 billed to my insurance company!!!!), I am really amazed at what I have just read. First, I don't think my ortho knew the Exogen could be used on fresh fractures and I had to wait 90 days in an uncomfortable boot to get the unit. As for how well it works, I don't know whether it was just time for the fracture (base of the 5th met) to heal, or the addition of supplements to my diet, or the unit itself that helped promote the healing. But that's not my issue right now. I'm a physical therapist and what really appalls me is the lack of professionalism between these sales reps. Especially the one claiming to be so successful because one of the competing reps was a whole 45 years old. I have to tell you that 45 is actually young.
Thank you for educating me as to what the reps are really concerned about. Not the patient. That's obvious. It's all about the money, fancy cars, market share and who can smooze the doctors better. I find this all really sad and now understand why the unit cost so much. I'm sure there's at least $100.00 worth of equipment in that package. But to charge $4500.00 is pure insanity. I'm aware through my own practice what the mark up is on medical equipment. You've all given me a whole new dislike of equipment reps. It was a good education. For that I thank you. For your high and mighty attitudes - I send you my sympathy. The day will come when you will be a patient just looking for help and on the other side of your doctor will be a sales rep in his fancy suit, carrying his expensive leather briefcase and driving his prestigious car. Next time pretend you're selling something your mother or father will be using. And remember, just a little humility goes a long way. In the meantime I'm going to print off all the foul garbage you've been spewing at each other and give it to every ortho whose patients I treat. I think they'll get a kick out of your true
motivation. Don't you?
Click to expand...
What did your insurance company pay is the question! As far as your observation of the quality of individuals that work in this industry,you have a lot of valid points. DME sales have always attracted used car sales types. They are dishonest,greedy and would step on their own mother to get ahead. To classify all device reps in this category would be incorrect. Surgical reps actually have to learn something about what they sell and can't get away with false claims. I hope the stim helped you. Last I checked PT rates were not cheap! You charge for supplies as well as bill some DME yourself I would think. In addition I bet you bill for everything you can get in order to make up for what you can't. Be careful of your glass house,you don't want to get cut by chards of your own creation.
 






EBI, Exogen, DJ Ortho it's all the same! Dumb bone stim! All these reps act like they are out there saving lives like doctors with only a couple weeks of training some a couple days. Seriously get a life befor you all argue about some dumb bone stim...
 






Anonymous said:
What did your insurance company pay is the question! As far as your observation of the quality of individuals that work in this industry,you have a lot of valid points. DME sales have always attracted used car sales types. They are dishonest,greedy and would step on their own mother to get ahead. To classify all device reps in this category would be incorrect. Surgical reps actually have to learn something about what they sell and can't get away with false claims. I hope the stim helped you. Last I checked PT rates were not cheap! You charge for supplies as well as bill some DME yourself I would think. In addition I bet you bill for everything you can get in order to make up for what you can't. Be careful of your glass house,you don't want to get cut by chards of your own creation.
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Bone Stimulators are not offered to DME homecare dealers because most would properly bill Medicare for the duration of medical need and rent the product. The "big four" manufacturers must now answer to the justice dept why did they initiate PURCHASE ONLY price fixing, and maximize profits by billing fraudulantly the 10 month purchase price with advertised healing time of 3 months, never offering a rental option. THIS IS OUTRIGHT BILLING FRAUD. Clearly, these big companies give us small DME dealers a bad name.
 






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