Depressed

[Anonymous]

Well, physiology dictates that women are generally more sensitive about everything, so what's your point? I'm sure you enjoy the "sensitivity" when it benefits you somehow.

 

[Anonymous]

Well, physiology dictates that women are generally more sensitive about everything, so what's your point? I'm sure you enjoy the "sensitivity" when it benefits you somehow.

Yes it would be nice if women could leave the dramatics at home…Women in this industry are so insecure. They are catty almost like junior HS and HS. They are generally the ones that feel they are ‘singled out’ and that their DM ‘doesn’t like them’. Guys, generally speaking, don’t bring this drama to the job. Most guys could care less if the DM doesn’t like them. Why women need to approach the job as something ‘bigger’ and more ‘significant’ is beyond me. If one allows themselves to get depressed over this silly job I agree that is more about them than it is about the job or the industry.

 

[Anonymous]

Yes it would be nice if women could leave the dramatics at home…Women in this industry are so insecure. They are catty almost like junior HS and HS. They are generally the ones that feel they are ‘singled out’ and that their DM ‘doesn’t like them’. Guys, generally speaking, don’t bring this drama to the job. Most guys could care less if the DM doesn’t like them. Why women need to approach the job as something ‘bigger’ and more ‘significant’ is beyond me. If one allows themselves to get depressed over this silly job I agree that is more about them than it is about the job or the industry.

I think a lot of the posts about hating the job, being embarrassed of it, being depressed, etc. are posted by men. I know a lot of women who actually enjoy the silly job. It's a good gig for mommy, a lot of the time. I hated it, found it insignificant and boring as hell, was embarrassed of what it became. And I'm female. I left.

 

[Anonymous]

I think a lot of the posts about hating the job, being embarrassed of it, being depressed, etc. are posted by men. I know a lot of women who actually enjoy the silly job. It's a good gig for mommy, a lot of the time. I hated it, found it insignificant and boring as hell, was embarrassed of what it became. And I'm female. I left.

Interesting point.

 

[Anonymous]

I just have to make a couple of quick comments here. The posts are so long, I didn't really read through them thoroughly (not complaining to those who posted. I'm just too tired at the moment to do it!).
Ok- a mind-numbing job has nothing to do with stress. Another job with "real stress, pressures, issues" would at least keep your mind occupied. When someone speaks of mind-numbness re: pharma it's not that (we) can't handle or compartmentalize stress. It's called going brain dead with boredom, tedious kindergarten activities, and having to push through your days like a zombie. Other sales people I know..different industries...have pressure, like many jobs, but one thing they are NOT is bored out of their skulls.

Other sales people I know in different industries DO NOT have to deal with the pharma INSANITY of the micromanaging managers. I don't know ANYONE who has to put up with the level of micro bs that we have endured in pharma. Treated like 5yr old children. That is NOT normal and not common elsewhere.

Pharma CAN cause severe anxiety and feelings of having a nervous breakdown, once you are targeted. This is NOT caused by having low self-esteem, lack of self respect or dignity. Come on now!
I personally think being/staying in a job where you are treated like a child in grade school shows a lack of self respect.
I was a tenured rep, highly compensated, always had good to great numbers (no, not exaggerating), NO problems with confidence, etc. and got targeted by my new, younger, gung-ho, alpha female of a manager....I am female as well. Up until the point I decided I was just going to get the heck out of the insanity of the job, and away from her, she DID cause a LOT of stress for me. Why? Because up until that point I had always wanted to do a good job, DID a good job, liked my job, and liked my managers. She literally fabricated stories and attempted to micromanage me to death. I was not, and am not, the ass-kissing type. She despised that about me. I also think I made more money than she did, and she was that very jealous type of woman. I can go on and on. Point is, a lot of us DON'T do anything wrong to warrant becoming a target, so no judgements can be made that all of us "must have done SOMETHING wrong". Simply not true.

Pharma is a different can of worms, that's for sure. And NO, we don't think other jobs would be heavenly. That's naive to think that we think that.
Like I said, of all the other sales people I know in other industries, not one of them deals with the shit I personally dealt with, and witnessed, in pharma. Highly tenured, successful reps have NO reason to EVER be micromanaged. Being in your 40s, educated, mature and treated like a little kid is NEVER warranted. There are SO many issues in this industry as a whole that I can't even name them all. Just saying....other people have their job complaints, of COURSE, but there is a "special something wrong" with pharma.
From a bird's eye view, it's plain as day.

thank you , thank you, thank you for this post...I can't believe these long posts that actually defend what goes on in pharma...I am a male that has your exact story, although I was targeted by a young, idiotic manager, cuz I didn't kiss as either...

Pharma turned into a living hell for me...This industry is indefensible...so wrong in so many ways...

Some people just dont get it until they become older, and get targeted for removal, despite their good numbers and tenure...

SICK FRIGGIN' INDUSTRY!!

 

[Anonymous]

I think a lot of the posts about hating the job, being embarrassed of it, being depressed, etc. are posted by men. I know a lot of women who actually enjoy the silly job. It's a good gig for mommy, a lot of the time. I hated it, found it insignificant and boring as hell, was embarrassed of what it became. And I'm female. I left.

great post, and you are certainly right about this...

For men, the job is not only dopey and boring, but emasculating as well...

Men (myself included) have a way tougher time with it...That is why I got out...

It is actually a good job if you are a mindless mommy....

 

[Anonymous]

Talk about being out of touch! Here is what you sound like, ‘I’m 40, I know everything, I’ve won every award, no one can tell me anything, not my manager, not a new person, no one. I was targeted because my DM was jealous’! Wow get over yourself already…boy that is a stark contrast to you telling me, “you are still telling everyone just how it is and refusing to listen to others points of view”. Wow pot meet kettle.

Oh so there is nowhere to go? Funny I looked on Medzilla, Sales Ladder, Med Reps, Healthcare reps, and found thousands of sales jobs all paying over $100K+.

I love when ‘pharma rep’ drones on about the ‘golden handcuffs’…here is a news flash for you. You don’t make enough money to have golden handcuffs. So stop blaming the job market, or your ‘trappings’ for why you can’t leave and go somewhere else. It is all on you. All I need to know about you is you whiny holier than thou know it all comments you made in your first post. I just bet you’re a joy to be around…umm yeah I bet it was the 20-30K more you MAY have made than your DM that got her all fired up…keep dreaming, it seems it’s what you do best. BTW if you were that good you would be out of big pharma primary care and into a real specialty at a great biotech…let me guess…you’re not getting those calls either…shocker.

great post...so true...I don't get why so many people stay in Big Pharma...it was such a depressing existence for anyone with ethics, morals and brains...

I don't agree with you statement about a "great biotech." I have worked for small biotechs and start-ups and the stay great as long as they have a good product, and don't grow much...once they start growing, all the BS comes in, and they turn into the AMGENS of tomorrow...I think calling on doctors is just a sucky way to make a living...doesn't matter if it is big pharma or biotech...it is all pretty crappy....

 

[Anonymous]

thank you , thank you, thank you for this post...I can't believe these long posts that actually defend what goes on in pharma...I am a male that has your exact story, although I was targeted by a young, idiotic manager, cuz I didn't kiss as either...

Pharma turned into a living hell for me...This industry is indefensible...so wrong in so many ways...

Some people just dont get it until they become older, and get targeted for removal, despite their good numbers and tenure...

SICK FRIGGIN' INDUSTRY!!

You are a pussy...

 

[Anonymous]

thank you , thank you, thank you for this post...I can't believe these long posts that actually defend what goes on in pharma...I am a male that has your exact story, although I was targeted by a young, idiotic manager, cuz I didn't kiss as either...

Pharma turned into a living hell for me...This industry is indefensible...so wrong in so many ways...

Some people just dont get it until they become older, and get targeted for removal, despite their good numbers and tenure...

SICK FRIGGIN' INDUSTRY!!

Dumbass I read every single one of these posts and nowhere is anyone defending pharma. What was written is that pharma is probably not as different as you think than many other jobs in other industries. Favoritism, jealously, micromanagement, incompetent leadership, boring jobs, questionable ethics, exists in all facets of life and all jobs, companies, and industries. What was stated was if you allow this ‘SICK FRIGGIN INDUSTRY” to ‘turn your life into a living hell’ that is on you. Get out, make a change and stop making excuses of why you can’t. I agree if you let a simple job like this make your life a living hell you are idiotic for enduring it for more that a month.

 

[Anonymous]

You are a pussy...

Umm, and you're a wimp who obviously stays in a pharma job to be lazy.
I'm not the post you responded to, btw. I just think you're too young and ignorant to "get it"

 

[Anonymous]

Dumbass I read every single one of these posts and nowhere is anyone defending pharma. What was written is that pharma is probably not as different as you think than many other jobs in other industries. Favoritism, jealously, micromanagement, incompetent leadership, boring jobs, questionable ethics, exists in all facets of life and all jobs, companies, and industries. What was stated was if you allow this ‘SICK FRIGGIN INDUSTRY” to ‘turn your life into a living hell’ that is on you. Get out, make a change and stop making excuses of why you can’t. I agree if you let a simple job like this make your life a living hell you are idiotic for enduring it for more that a month.

Well to me it sounds as though some dingbats are defending micromanagement.
I don't care if you sell devices, do "marketing/PR" sales or pick up turds for a living. If you know what you're doing and getting the job done well then NO ONE should EVER have to MICROMANAGE you!! If they are, then they're just an incompetent manager. period.

 

[Anonymous]

great post...so true...I don't get why so many people stay in Big Pharma...it was such a depressing existence for anyone with ethics, morals and brains...

I don't agree with you statement about a "great biotech." I have worked for small biotechs and start-ups and the stay great as long as they have a good product, and don't grow much...once they start growing, all the BS comes in, and they turn into the AMGENS of tomorrow...I think calling on doctors is just a sucky way to make a living...doesn't matter if it is big pharma or biotech...it is all pretty crappy....

First Amgen jumped the shark 15 years ago so I am not talking about the Genentech’s and Amgen’s of the world. There are far more biotechs with a commercially approved drugs who are not listed in the CP Company Boards. I was a Genentech person 8 years ago and most of us have stuck together and continue to find the next small/midsize biotech. They are out there. I would also disagree that calling on physicians sucks. If you are good at what you do, have good products, and work for a good company and call on a good specialty (not PC/IM/Cardio/etc) it can be a lot of fun. I think most of the rumblings on this board are the big pharma, mass market, primary care reps who by definition are complete losers. If you spend more than three years in those roles suffice to say you are a loser and have only yourself to blame for your “depression”.

 

[Anonymous]

Well to me it sounds as though some dingbats are defending micromanagement.
I don't care if you sell devices, do "marketing/PR" sales or pick up turds for a living. If you know what you're doing and getting the job done well then NO ONE should EVER have to MICROMANAGE you!! If they are, then they're just an incompetent manager. period.

I agree then if you are talented you should have no problems finding work elsewhere and not having to deal with this BS. Yet you don’t. You just bitch to your colleagues and rant on Café Pharma but yet you do nothing to get to where you think you deserve to be. How about this, maybe you’re just not as good as you think you are. Like the other poster stated. Micromanagement may be necessary for some reps to be sure, if you are not one of them then you should do something about it. What I will say is micromanagement is not a term that was coined in pharma. It can happen in every job in every industry at any company. Micromanagement is not symptom of pharma it is a personality trait and micromanagers are in all walks of life.

 

[Anonymous]

Umm, and you're a wimp who obviously stays in a pharma job to be lazy.
I'm not the post you responded to, btw. I just think you're too young and ignorant to "get it"

17 years in the industry. Have been a rep and DM and a RBD and I am 40 years old. I’ve spent the last 12 years or so of my career in oncology. I have forgotten more about this business than you have ever learned. I don’t stay because I’m lazy I stay because I haven’t made less than $200K in 11 years, I have made hundreds of thousands on stock options at two different biotechs and I am poised for at least one more big win. I stay because if you have a set of balls and are not a stupid “state schooler” you can carve out a decent living with many perks and benefits with probably the most flexible work schedule imaginable. So before you come at me with what I don’t know tell me what you know about this business other than you are too stupid to get out of big pharma primary care and you can’t manage your career enough to have options to leave when you want to leave.

 

[Anonymous]

17 years in the industry. Have been a rep and DM and a RBD and I am 40 years old. I’ve spent the last 12 years or so of my career in oncology. I have forgotten more about this business than you have ever learned. I don’t stay because I’m lazy I stay because I haven’t made less than $200K in 11 years, I have made hundreds of thousands on stock options at two different biotechs and I am poised for at least one more big win. I stay because if you have a set of balls and are not a stupid “state schooler” you can carve out a decent living with many perks and benefits with probably the most flexible work schedule imaginable. So before you come at me with what I don’t know tell me what you know about this business other than you are too stupid to get out of big pharma primary care and you can’t manage your career enough to have options to leave when you want to leave.

Well genius, I'm the one who left the joke of an industry and started my own business.
You don't have a pair, compared to what I've done. I never had to be in PC, never was in big pharma, spent 15 years in the industry (O.R. sales mostly, did oncology also, etc. ALL specialty, right from day 1), and created, from scratch, my own future after being done with all the bs madness of pharma. So stay in your corporate job and continue reporting to other people and making money for other people.
Now who's the stupid one?

 

[Anonymous]

17 years in the industry. Have been a rep and DM and a RBD and I am 40 years old. I’ve spent the last 12 years or so of my career in oncology. I have forgotten more about this business than you have ever learned. I don’t stay because I’m lazy I stay because I haven’t made less than $200K in 11 years, I have made hundreds of thousands on stock options at two different biotechs and I am poised for at least one more big win. I stay because if you have a set of balls and are not a stupid “state schooler” you can carve out a decent living with many perks and benefits with probably the most flexible work schedule imaginable. So before you come at me with what I don’t know tell me what you know about this business other than you are too stupid to get out of big pharma primary care and you can’t manage your career enough to have options to leave when you want to leave


This genius keeps replying to different people and thinks it is the same person he is referring to. He has probably gotten into disagreements with at least 10 different people just on this thread. I am sure that he is really a fun person to be around.

 

[Anonymous]

Well genius, I'm the one who left the joke of an industry and started my own business.
You don't have a pair, compared to what I've done. I never had to be in PC, never was in big pharma, spent 15 years in the industry (O.R. sales mostly, did oncology also, etc. ALL specialty, right from day 1), and created, from scratch, my own future after being done with all the bs madness of pharma. So stay in your corporate job and continue reporting to other people and making money for other people.
Now who's the stupid one?

I’ll put my portfolio up against yours any day of the week. Good luck to you when your “business” fails, btw. I too have my own consulting business and can make an extra $250K a year on the side, all with the blessing of my big bad corporation. See that is what is nice once you get to a certain level in this business your experience is valuable and people pay for. My most recent venture was to help a small startup build out its commercial business unit. Made a fast $50K for a few days’ work.

BTW glad to see that you started your own business yet you troll on Café Pharma. Wow you must be doing so well that you get to sit in front of your computer and comment on an industry you dislike and no longer work in…um I just think you proved that you are the stupid one.

 

[Anonymous]

17 years in the industry. Have been a rep and DM and a RBD and I am 40 years old. I’ve spent the last 12 years or so of my career in oncology. I have forgotten more about this business than you have ever learned. I don’t stay because I’m lazy I stay because I haven’t made less than $200K in 11 years, I have made hundreds of thousands on stock options at two different biotechs and I am poised for at least one more big win. I stay because if you have a set of balls and are not a stupid “state schooler” you can carve out a decent living with many perks and benefits with probably the most flexible work schedule imaginable. So before you come at me with what I don’t know tell me what you know about this business other than you are too stupid to get out of big pharma primary care and you can’t manage your career enough to have options to leave when you want to leave


This genius keeps replying to different people and thinks it is the same person he is referring to. He has probably gotten into disagreements with at least 10 different people just on this thread. I am sure that he is really a fun person to be around.

LOL! I'm with you!

 

[Anonymous]

17 years in the industry. Have been a rep and DM and a RBD and I am 40 years old. I’ve spent the last 12 years or so of my career in oncology. I have forgotten more about this business than you have ever learned. I don’t stay because I’m lazy I stay because I haven’t made less than $200K in 11 years, I have made hundreds of thousands on stock options at two different biotechs and I am poised for at least one more big win. I stay because if you have a set of balls and are not a stupid “state schooler” you can carve out a decent living with many perks and benefits with probably the most flexible work schedule imaginable. So before you come at me with what I don’t know tell me what you know about this business other than you are too stupid to get out of big pharma primary care and you can’t manage your career enough to have options to leave when you want to leave


This genius keeps replying to different people and thinks it is the same person he is referring to. He has probably gotten into disagreements with at least 10 different people just on this thread. I am sure that he is really a fun person to be around.

…and I’m sure all of you downtrodden and depressed pharma hacks are the life of the party.

 

[Anonymous]

LOL! I'm with you!

Cleary misery loves company and you pharma losers like to come on here as some form of therapy. So keep hating what you do, and allowing others to dictate your happiness in life. That makes a ton of sense.