Why do so many people hate this job?

[Anonymous]

I Beg to Differ.

 

[Anonymous]

Here is reality:

Those that lack intelligence and can't cut it in pharma hate the business.

Those that use their brain are successful in the business and are satisfied with what they do.

If you don't like it and can't cut it, just get out. Simple as that.

 

[Anonymous]

Here is reality:

Those that lack intelligence and can't cut it in pharma hate the business.

Those that use their brain are successful in the business and are satisfied with what they do.

If you don't like it and can't cut it, just get out. Simple as that.

What is so intelligent about reading a canned marketing piece to a doctor and highlighting points of a study to a doctor?

Define cutting it in the business? What are those variables that show a level of skill that one would be impressed with please?

Define being successful? Good numbers? Do you really think you have anything to do with it? Are you willing to factor in formulary wins for your 400 percent increase in numbers for a year? Conversely, is it your fault when you are taken of formulary next year and your sales are down 340 percent?

Following your flawed logic, I was not intelligent and couldn't cut it in the business due to some nebulous variables I am sure you are going to quote, therefore I hated my job. Since I hated my job I inevitably left to get Into device, doubled my income, and am happier?

Truth is the more I used my brain in pharma the more I hated it.

 

[Anonymous]

Here is reality:

Those that lack intelligence and can't cut it in pharma hate the business.

Those that use their brain are successful in the business and are satisfied with what they do.

If you don't like it and can't cut it, just get out. Simple as that.

This is possibly the dumbest comment ever posted on Internet history, a post that will be talked about for decades.

Cutting it in corporate sales is not about selling, it is about making your manager happy, and we should all know that managers are happy when they have reps kissing up to them.

It has nothing to do with talent.

Those that are cutting it in the business world are not in pharma, they are starting their own business or working in a stronger market, usually with smaller companies that reward results.

Pharma sales does not reward results, but people that get 8-10 signatures a day to prove they are working, and that has nothing to with selling, probably something you know nothing about because you have not sold anything in your life.

Instead, you have likely been in pharma you entire life and were brainwashed into thinking you are a cutting edge professional.

Well, I am here to tell you, you are not. Get over it. Face the reality, that are you are nothing but a YES man or woman.

 

[Anonymous]

Bump.
This is an all time great thread. And good reading for my sanity now that I am out of pharma.

 

[Anonymous]

It's the worst best job you'll ever have. I'm currently in what should be the best job of my career. Unfortunately, the best day at this job so far was the day I accepted the offer. It's been downhill each year since then.

I enjoy what pharma is for daily calls, meeting with people, etc. It's all the other company crap that gets worse all the time. It used to be reports and business planning and meetings and compliance and training took up 10-20 % of your time. The majority was supposed to be spent with customers. Now it's easily 50-50. Each year the company makes changes that they sell to us as being beneficial to our time and our jobs. ie: a new computer program that will save us time or help us be better in front of customers. ie: new training to read and pass. It goes on. How about another meeting? I've yet to see a new computer program make life or service better. Much yet another meeting. Meetings are just done to justify the jobs of managers.

Job security is non-existent. Period. If it doesn't bother someone to go to work each day and not care at all about what you're investing into your future and career, have at it. That's what it takes to continue. Good pay and a whole lotta crap without a future.

 

[Anonymous]

It's the worst best job you'll ever have. I'm currently in what should be the best job of my career. Unfortunately, the best day at this job so far was the day I accepted the offer. It's been downhill each year since then.

I enjoy what pharma is for daily calls, meeting with people, etc. It's all the other company crap that gets worse all the time. It used to be reports and business planning and meetings and compliance and training took up 10-20 % of your time. The majority was supposed to be spent with customers. Now it's easily 50-50. Each year the company makes changes that they sell to us as being beneficial to our time and our jobs. ie: a new computer program that will save us time or help us be better in front of customers. ie: new training to read and pass. It goes on. How about another meeting? I've yet to see a new computer program make life or service better. Much yet another meeting. Meetings are just done to justify the jobs of managers.

Job security is non-existent. Period. If it doesn't bother someone to go to work each day and not care at all about what you're investing into your future and career, have at it. That's what it takes to continue. Good pay and a whole lotta crap without a future.

true 'dat...pharma is a road to nowwhere...you get seduced by the money and then wake up one day in your 40s or 50s and you are skilless and unemployable.

 

[Anonymous]

Speak for yourself, Dillweed. I was in pharma for 16 years and am now working with a great group of people who actually think for a living in an IT department for a Fortune 500 company. I learned a helluva lot about prioritizing, time management, computer skills, just to name a few. Because I was skilled in disseminating "technical" information, I was hired to learn on the job. It just depends on how you market yourself and how hard you want to work.

 

[Anonymous]

Speak for yourself, Dillweed. I was in pharma for 16 years and am now working with a great group of people who actually think for a living in an IT department for a Fortune 500 company. I learned a helluva lot about prioritizing, time management, computer skills, just to name a few. Because I was skilled in disseminating "technical" information, I was hired to learn on the job. It just depends on how you market yourself and how hard you want to work.

How old are you Dillweed? probably young enough to think you are hot shit...

wait until your IT company gets to know your deli slinging ass...

you can take the boy out of pharma, but you can't take the pharma out of the boy....

 

[Anonymous]

I am fascinated when I read the posts regarding job satisfaction in the pharma industry. I was a pharma rep for 3 plus years and truly enjoyed my job. I realized early on that this business was a ticket to a wonderful future. Why? After five months of selling against the competition I realized the only thing I had to do was actually work. The basic concept of work was actually seeing physicians early in the morning and late in the afternoon. Most reps don't understand that physicians who see a rep at 4pm believe this person to be a hard worker. Some of these basic principles enabled me to win a few of the awards the company offered, but it also allowed me to start asking for more money. Even though your manager is most likely an idiot, he still wants to be relevant to his managers. Therefore, it is a relatively easy model to employ. Try it!
What I find to be amazing is the ridiculous opportunities in the medical industry. I read some of the posts on this thread but, I find that a majority of these posts are bad advice. If you don't feel comfortable listening to office people talk about there dysfunction, Dr's asking for signatures(those reps who are treated this way should ask themselves why the physician says this to you-there is a reason), meeting after nonsense meeting, lunches, blah blah blah......then this business is not for you. However, if you enjoy the opportunity to make between $75,000-$150,000 a year, work 20-30 hours per week, see the golden ticket(Willy Wonka), get promoted, jump to bigger and better things, spend time with your family, run your own business, recognize a niche in this industry(vendor credentialing service) and have a little fun. If all these things appeal to you than this is the business you should be in. Forget the BS when you tell people that you are not appreciated, respected, you have to deal with low decile individuals and there is no satisfaction. If you spent one minute to observe that most physicians and nurses in the hospital are treated like garbage, than you might believe you have a good gig! Good luck finding everything that you enjoy. It does not pay!!!
After 3 plus years I left the pharma industry and went to the medical device industry. Some pharma reps I worked with told me I was crazy and that I would be back. I learned that others don't actually want you to succeed, they relish the opportunity to see people fail. Don't listen to them. It was the best decision that I ever made. I realized there were more levels to the medical industry and most of these things are untapped! Untapped means huge opportunity to make obscene amounts of money, run your own business, call your own shots and feel relevant to yourself and your family. No matter how much money you make, people with still treat you like shit, disrespect you, ask you to buy lunch for them, think your a loser and still probably ask you for an ffing signature. There are plenty of jobs in this industry to have most of the things you want. Managers don't mess with people that produce. They don't ride along with people who work, make them successful or make them money. They are not stupid. They are lazy like most pharma reps who have the GOLDEN TICKET! Utilize your excellent training that you receive to jump to bigger and better things.

I still believe the best job I ever had was a pharma rep! Until I realized I could have it all.

 

[Anonymous]

I am fascinated when I read the posts regarding job satisfaction in the pharma industry. I was a pharma rep for 3 plus years and truly enjoyed my job. I realized early on that this business was a ticket to a wonderful future. Why? After five months of selling against the competition I realized the only thing I had to do was actually work. The basic concept of work was actually seeing physicians early in the morning and late in the afternoon. Most reps don't understand that physicians who see a rep at 4pm believe this person to be a hard worker. Some of these basic principles enabled me to win a few of the awards the company offered, but it also allowed me to start asking for more money. Even though your manager is most likely an idiot, he still wants to be relevant to his managers. Therefore, it is a relatively easy model to employ. Try it!
What I find to be amazing is the ridiculous opportunities in the medical industry. I read some of the posts on this thread but, I find that a majority of these posts are bad advice. If you don't feel comfortable listening to office people talk about there dysfunction, Dr's asking for signatures(those reps who are treated this way should ask themselves why the physician says this to you-there is a reason), meeting after nonsense meeting, lunches, blah blah blah......then this business is not for you. However, if you enjoy the opportunity to make between $75,000-$150,000 a year, work 20-30 hours per week, see the golden ticket(Willy Wonka), get promoted, jump to bigger and better things, spend time with your family, run your own business, recognize a niche in this industry(vendor credentialing service) and have a little fun. If all these things appeal to you than this is the business you should be in. Forget the BS when you tell people that you are not appreciated, respected, you have to deal with low decile individuals and there is no satisfaction. If you spent one minute to observe that most physicians and nurses in the hospital are treated like garbage, than you might believe you have a good gig! Good luck finding everything that you enjoy. It does not pay!!!
After 3 plus years I left the pharma industry and went to the medical device industry. Some pharma reps I worked with told me I was crazy and that I would be back. I learned that others don't actually want you to succeed, they relish the opportunity to see people fail. Don't listen to them. It was the best decision that I ever made. I realized there were more levels to the medical industry and most of these things are untapped! Untapped means huge opportunity to make obscene amounts of money, run your own business, call your own shots and feel relevant to yourself and your family. No matter how much money you make, people with still treat you like shit, disrespect you, ask you to buy lunch for them, think your a loser and still probably ask you for an ffing signature. There are plenty of jobs in this industry to have most of the things you want. Managers don't mess with people that produce. They don't ride along with people who work, make them successful or make them money. They are not stupid. They are lazy like most pharma reps who have the GOLDEN TICKET! Utilize your excellent training that you receive to jump to bigger and better things.

I still believe the best job I ever had was a pharma rep! Until I realized I could have it all.

Well, working with doctors is not a walk in the park either.
Also, you are still a puppet for the corporation, as long as you get a base salary.

I think you are still a little naive, and probably were fortunate to have very good managers along the way.

Lots of us have not been as "lucky", and see thing differently. WE are the ones that produced and never got credit for that production, and then still got downsized to boot.

Give yourself a solid 15-20 years of selling and then give us the pep talk.

YOu sound like you have been selling for 5 years, and that is just when you are getting started as a professional.

 

[Anonymous]

15-plus years here and I find the business horrible and very unrewarding. I am hospital specialty and access where I live is a nightmare unless you have something truly new. I hear what the PP is saying. I have produced and produced again, had the highest MS growth, the highest dollar vol growth and still watched hand chosen kiss ass dweebs with lower goals get the big awards and bonuses. It is all well-planned by management and you do not want to grow old in this industry. They won't let you. In my career, I have been downsized or reorganized (I kid you not) 8 times. I have had my territory changed probably 20 times. It is virtually impossible to build a relationship or even a selling system when corporate changes the game every year. I hate it but am too old to get out now and I still need the money.

 

[Anonymous]

15-plus years here and I find the business horrible and very unrewarding. I am hospital specialty and access where I live is a nightmare unless you have something truly new. I hear what the PP is saying. I have produced and produced again, had the highest MS growth, the highest dollar vol growth and still watched hand chosen kiss ass dweebs with lower goals get the big awards and bonuses. It is all well-planned by management and you do not want to grow old in this industry. They won't let you. In my career, I have been downsized or reorganized (I kid you not) 8 times. I have had my territory changed probably 20 times. It is virtually impossible to build a relationship or even a selling system when corporate changes the game every year. I hate it but am too old to get out now and I still need the money.

Change the measure.
You should STRONGLY consider downsizing.

If you are married, then I hope you have a good one. If not, then it should be simple.

I did it for about 10-15 years, and just had enough. Turned down one last offer, to move into independent repping, and it was the best decision I have ever made. I work a lot harder, but I want to do it.
I am respected by my company (a private company, most indepenents are), by my colleagues (no back stabbers) and my boss (he is a support, not a pencil neck geek like you have in pharma).

I would never tell you to quit a job, but make an exit out. You don't have to live that way.

Good luck. I feel for you.

 

[Anonymous]

I don't understand you guys. You all complain of feeling worthless, yet none of you pursued careers in professions where you can actually have an impact on another humans life, like teaching, nursing, speech therapist, etc...You all seem to have made the "wrong" decision by going into pharma, yet none of you pursued other career paths. It's not "big pharma's" fault that you're miserable, it's your own. You could have taken night classes pursuing what truly makde you happy. I realize pharma may not be "real" sales, but in what company would you rather be working? Financial sector? Retail? Insurance?

If the grass is greener then do what you have to do and move into that industry. No one is holding you back. Network, use Linkedin, make connections. I am 30, new to pharma, I came from a b2b sales job, I make more money now and there is a lot less stress. This is not where I will end up, I have goals, drive and ambition. I am a natural "sales" guy, it's in my blood. Ask my family or gf, when I want you to see things my way, I am relentless until you do. I am not bound to pharma, I do not believe that a medical device company wouldn't hire me. If I chose to pursue medical device sales, I would land a job by being persistent, tenacious, and pushy. I don't give a f...uck if I hear "No" a few times. I don't sit around and wait for good things to happen to me, I go out there and make shiit happen. I ask for the business and make people feel uncomfortable. I make shiit happen.

 

[Anonymous]

I don't understand you guys. You all complain of feeling worthless, yet none of you pursued careers in professions where you can actually have an impact on another humans life, like teaching, nursing, speech therapist, etc...You all seem to have made the "wrong" decision by going into pharma, yet none of you pursued other career paths. It's not "big pharma's" fault that you're miserable, it's your own. You could have taken night classes pursuing what truly makde you happy. I realize pharma may not be "real" sales, but in what company would you rather be working? Financial sector? Retail? Insurance?

If the grass is greener then do what you have to do and move into that industry. No one is holding you back. Network, use Linkedin, make connections. I am 30, new to pharma, I came from a b2b sales job, I make more money now and there is a lot less stress. This is not where I will end up, I have goals, drive and ambition. I am a natural "sales" guy, it's in my blood. Ask my family or gf, when I want you to see things my way, I am relentless until you do. I am not bound to pharma, I do not believe that a medical device company wouldn't hire me. If I chose to pursue medical device sales, I would land a job by being persistent, tenacious, and pushy. I don't give a f...uck if I hear "No" a few times. I don't sit around and wait for good things to happen to me, I go out there and make shiit happen. I ask for the business and make people feel uncomfortable. I make shiit happen.

You're an asshole.

 

[Anonymous]

I don't sit around and wait for good things to happen to me, I go out there and make shiit happen. I ask for the business and make people feel uncomfortable. I make shiit happen.

I've also found that making people uncomfortable helps build business relationships and repeat sales - no doubt you make shit happen.

 

[Anonymous]

I don't understand you guys. You all complain of feeling worthless, yet none of you pursued careers in professions where you can actually have an impact on another humans life, like teaching, nursing, speech therapist, etc...You all seem to have made the "wrong" decision by going into pharma, yet none of you pursued other career paths. It's not "big pharma's" fault that you're miserable, it's your own. You could have taken night classes pursuing what truly makde you happy. I realize pharma may not be "real" sales, but in what company would you rather be working? Financial sector? Retail? Insurance?

If the grass is greener then do what you have to do and move into that industry. No one is holding you back. Network, use Linkedin, make connections. I am 30, new to pharma, I came from a b2b sales job, I make more money now and there is a lot less stress. This is not where I will end up, I have goals, drive and ambition. I am a natural "sales" guy, it's in my blood. Ask my family or gf, when I want you to see things my way, I am relentless until you do. I am not bound to pharma, I do not believe that a medical device company wouldn't hire me. If I chose to pursue medical device sales, I would land a job by being persistent, tenacious, and pushy. I don't give a f...uck if I hear "No" a few times. I don't sit around and wait for good things to happen to me, I go out there and make shiit happen. I ask for the business and make people feel uncomfortable. I make shiit happen.

I can tell you that I am in my early 30s, work in an upper echelon med device job and didn't get here by being this "faux alpha male" you describe. I came from b2b and then pharma to here. I am glad you have watched some motivational training videos or sat through copier salesman training, but the attitude you display makes me relish the opportunity to sell against you some day.

People don't buy from pushy sales reps. They buy from sales reps. that are assertive, sure, but they buy from sales reps. who understand their needs, present a solution for their needs, ask for the business and have great post sale follow-up. Being a pushy rep. is the opposite of that. Being pushy is not listening, bullying, presenting a solution that meets YOUR needs (meaning gets you a bonus for selling that particular unit), etc.

There is no such thing as a natural sales guy. My skills of selling are a combination of training I have received at work, on my own, seminars and BEST OF ALL, the school of hard knocks...which is messing up and learning to not do what I just I did again.

I have seen the "American Psycho" type alpha males in this job. And you know what? They either bounce from job-to-job (see linked-in), have a terrible reputation in the industry they are in, and are not pleasant to be around in general. Furthermore, their numbers never matched their attitude.

Look, work is work. I work to live. At 5 PM, the cell phone goes to silent and I stop answering emails. Life is about working hard, but my primary obligation in life is to be there for my wife and young daughter. You will learn this too.

I SINCERELY hope this is a troll post.

 

[Anonymous]

I can tell you that I am in my early 30s, work in an upper echelon med device job and didn't get here by being this "faux alpha male" you describe. I came from b2b and then pharma to here. I am glad you have watched some motivational training videos or sat through copier salesman training, but the attitude you display makes me relish the opportunity to sell against you some day.

People don't buy from pushy sales reps. They buy from sales reps. that are assertive, sure, but they buy from sales reps. who understand their needs, present a solution for their needs, ask for the business and have great post sale follow-up. Being a pushy rep. is the opposite of that. Being pushy is not listening, bullying, presenting a solution that meets YOUR needs (meaning gets you a bonus for selling that particular unit), etc.

There is no such thing as a natural sales guy. My skills of selling are a combination of training I have received at work, on my own, seminars and BEST OF ALL, the school of hard knocks...which is messing up and learning to not do what I just I did again.

I have seen the "American Psycho" type alpha males in this job. And you know what? They either bounce from job-to-job (see linked-in), have a terrible reputation in the industry they are in, and are not pleasant to be around in general. Furthermore, their numbers never matched their attitude.

Look, work is work. I work to live. At 5 PM, the cell phone goes to silent and I stop answering emails. Life is about working hard, but my primary obligation in life is to be there for my wife and young daughter. You will learn this too.

I SINCERELY hope this is a troll post.

Could not of said it better myself. The sad part is the attitude this individual displays is what senior management at most of these organizations want to see even though it is not effective.

Nice post.

 

[Anonymous]

You sound like Stryker material. Give me a call ASAP for an interview.

I don't understand you guys. You all complain of feeling worthless, yet none of you pursued careers in professions where you can actually have an impact on another humans life, like teaching, nursing, speech therapist, etc...You all seem to have made the "wrong" decision by going into pharma, yet none of you pursued other career paths. It's not "big pharma's" fault that you're miserable, it's your own. You could have taken night classes pursuing what truly makde you happy. I realize pharma may not be "real" sales, but in what company would you rather be working? Financial sector? Retail? Insurance?

If the grass is greener then do what you have to do and move into that industry. No one is holding you back. Network, use Linkedin, make connections. I am 30, new to pharma, I came from a b2b sales job, I make more money now and there is a lot less stress. This is not where I will end up, I have goals, drive and ambition. I am a natural "sales" guy, it's in my blood. Ask my family or gf, when I want you to see things my way, I am relentless until you do. I am not bound to pharma, I do not believe that a medical device company wouldn't hire me. If I chose to pursue medical device sales, I would land a job by being persistent, tenacious, and pushy. I don't give a f...uck if I hear "No" a few times. I don't sit around and wait for good things to happen to me, I go out there and make shiit happen. I ask for the business and make people feel uncomfortable. I make shiit happen.

 

[Anonymous]

I have been in pharma for about 6 years now. Have you ever heard of the "golden hand cuffs?" I am a single mom and own a home. As much as I want to get my teaching credential and move on, I am stuck. I would have to sell my house and uproot my kids. For me, every day is a challenge. I live outside my territory (not by choice), and it feels like ground hog day every day. I WISH, I could move on to something that is more intrinsically rewarding to me, but due to finances, I can't. Reading these posts have been helpful that I am not alone out there!