If you are over 40 year old and a rep - You are done in pharmaceuticals

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Anonymous said:
I got displaced at AZ when I was 42, 2 years ago. I too had a life of 11-3 every day. I often did lunch for 2 hours and put minimal effort into the job. During this time, I had a PT job as a bartender outside of the territory. I would not be home sometimes till 2am but I didnt need to be out in territory till 10am anyway. I made lots of tips working at a bar. AZ gave me benefits. I would sometimes wake and do a conference call then go back to bed. I would always have my A game for my DSM who almost always cancled or did a half day... It was the perfect compliment. I cant see AZ now NOT knowing that the average rep and DSM is doing part time work. The DM's dont really keep a close eye on the reps. They really dont care. They want the numbers but they TOO want to be home at 3:45 pm to see the kids. Its a big facade. I can honestly say I took major advantage of az but had a nice 15 year job there. Lots of great meals. Now, in mid 40's it time to grow up and get a job and start working. Thats my life at AZ story !
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Thanks for the input buttlicker!
 




I did the same thing during my time in pharma. I come back here to still see what's going on. I worked two jobs here because if you can't excel from 10-2 then you just don't have it.

Similarly, after seeing sales goals messed around with, I decided to pay myself with some of the benefits. Dinners with the wife and kids on the company. Making friends with caters that would give me cash, etc. What do they expect when they take money out of my pocket? I'm gonna find a way to take it back.

These days, they hire young kids to do the job. And, for what the job has become, its a good choice. No need to keep around someone experienced to drop samples.

i applaud you man, I really do!

I am now an attorney and love what i do. Thanks AZ!

Anonymous said:
I am a 49 year old rep that took the severance in November. The fifteen years I spent at AZ were great. Not only did I have a great expense account which I took full advantage of, and I do mean advantage, but I only worked from 11 to 4 everyday except when my manager "of the moment" was with me. Many days were often spent having a 2 hour or longer lunch with reps from other companies, and many doctors whose company I enjoyed. I figured that I only would do enough to make bonus and no more as I already had achieved a level four and because AZ had played games with goals in October for several years in a row and I decided never to blow it out again. They stole my bonus, and the bonus of other hard working reps and it took me four years to get mine back through creative methods. Not only was I happy, but I did well, watched my kids grow up, and had plenty of time to do extra jobs on the side and do much work on my house.

My world came to an end when we had to do the sign in sheets and couldn't take docs out to lunch and dinner. The only thing I could do then was play other games, which were not as much fun. What was fun was faking all of the calls in Touchstone while making the calls that counted. I did more than 40 speaker programs last year too, all were pretty much a waste of time as the same lame docs came to them. Fortunately I had a great counterpart that I enjoyed working with. There are many great and talented people at AZ but the current management sucks, my last manager being the personification of insipid and lacking any leadership skill. So I left my plum job.

Am I lazy? Well, I worked an extra job the entire time I was with AZ. I rebuilt much of my house and I went back to school and got a masters. The job was the vehicle to do this and I can't say how much I enjoyed it. I am financially well off and thank AZ for helping me achieve this. Now, I have a job that is more complicated and requires more effort but the payoff is that my salary is not capped. Don't believe that after 10, 15 or even 22 years in pharmaceuticals your world is at an end. It's only just beginning. You just have to be creative and rise to the occasion. I can honestly say I hated my last DSM, but I had many good ones as well and I thank my lucky stars for the time I had in pharma.
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Anonymous said:
The reps who decided to stay in the field for 10 -15 years and not advance their careers are done. Not only done in pharmaceuticals, done in any sales job that pays you close to the money you are making. Your laziness and lack of risk will cost you. This is not to be mean, it is reality. So reps from Philadelphia area take note. You know who you are.
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Are you referring to the guy from the suburbs of Philadelphia who always brags about his motorcycle
 












Over 50 here, with almost 30 years in. Truth is this is the best part time job anyone could ever have. I know where to get business, spend about 20 to max 30 hours per week doing it and enjoy life.
 




I am over 40 and I feel beautiful and still turn guys heads. I have been in pharma for ten years and truly enjoy this career choice. I lost my parent years ago and my passion being a part of this fabulous industry makes me very happy. It is sad that some people have to be negative and talk bad and point fingers. Sad to be you!
 




Anonymous said:
I am over 40 and I feel beautiful and still turn guys heads. I have been in pharma for ten years and truly enjoy this career choice. I lost my parent years ago and my passion being a part of this fabulous industry makes me very happy. It is sad that some people have to be negative and talk bad and point fingers. Sad to be you!
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You might feel beautiful, but you look ugly. How do I know this? You're over 40.
 




Anonymous said:
If you are a rep in the pharmaceutical industry you are done. Do your research and read PHRMA says about pharma and the future or do research on-line. Fact is, regulations and laws in the health care industry prevent and/or will prevent many of the rep's activity. That is why the trend for PharmD's and Clinical Liaison's has begun. It's not a matter of age and not moving up the ladder, it is a matter of careers of the future.
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This is very true, oh so true. I was in Pharma from 2001-2009. I started in primary care and moved up by switching companies to speciality, hospital and finally biologic sales. Then my whole company was laid off and we were all let go, very senior sales people. Once the recsession hit, these companies were taking advantage and trying to push managers to speciality or hospital, hospital and speciality to primary care and primary care out. I was offered a few primary care jobs and like 2/3 my former salary. I decide dto go another rep and now I'm in dental and it's a nicer space.

I agree that you should have an exit plan for pharma.
 




I love it! So true, so true!!!! you cant compete with experience.

Anonymous said:
Here's the bottom line. The post is correct the older you get the less you are wanted by a company that values youth. So for the people in your late 20's and 30's, just know that their is a fifth grader who will some day be your boss and showing you the door. Its the circle of life in pharma.
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Why is everyone so mean? If you liked your job for the last 20 years, then you were probably good at it. Not every rep is lazy. Why not encourage people to do well in the position they are in instead of beating someone down. Outside the industry, Pharma is looked at as very professional, educated and well trained...that is the truth and you know it. So how about we stand together and help each other out instead of saying nasty things to people. We are all in the same boat here.
 




Anonymous said:
Why is everyone so mean? If you liked your job for the last 20 years, then you were probably good at it. Not every rep is lazy. Why not encourage people to do well in the position they are in instead of beating someone down. Outside the industry, Pharma is looked at as very professional, educated and well trained...that is the truth and you know it. So how about we stand together and help each other out instead of saying nasty things to people. We are all in the same boat here.
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suck my balls
 




Lets see, for someone who is gamefully employed, comfortably making over 125K, stand to have over 1.5 million in 401K with a free car with gas and has job flexibility........ its cool with me if you think that "I`m done." You should look in the mirror at yourself instead of worrying about me...... I`m pretty set. You on the other hand seem to have some issues!
 




I'm one of the almost exclusively 'women over 40' (only 1 guy, all the rest women) who were let go in the Northeast last year. Curious, no?

It's true that there's an incredible bias against pharma sales when you're looking for a new job. I recommend repacking yourself as Account Manager, because pharma sales truly is more of an account management job and the skill sets line right up.

At all the Lee Hecht Harrison (the outplacement services you get) meetings, it's 90% white men in their 50's. They are having the worst time finding new work, even in high demand industries like finance and IT. So it could be worse. Being a white woman in your 40's is second from the bottom.

I have to laugh at the irony of interviews for device or surgical products. I recently had an informal/informational one at the outplacement office, and the HR person asked me if I have any OR experience. I told her no, but I had been in endoscopies and in-office procedures. When she frowned, I asked her what recommendations she might have for gaining OR experience . . . for example, should I go to nursing school?

She replied that they usually hired salespeople with 1-3 years experience (I have over 15) who had credentials like President's Club. So I asked her where these people had gotten their OR experience and she paused. She admitted that these salespeople had come from selling for companies like Adidas or Xerox.

So they clearly had no OR experience . . . but chances are they are hotshot asshole 25 year old guys. Who probably will do the job for 1-2 years and then move on to another device company.

She thought I might faint in the OR. Really? Even doctors tell you that you can never tell who will or won't faint in the OR. Sometimes it's surprising.

So it's really just a bullshit preconceived notion, that you need OR experience or prior device sales. Somebody is getting these device jobs with NO experience at all in order to have it in the first place. I actually know a guy who sold pacemakers when he was 24 . . . he's a hotshot asshole who can't even tie his own shoes and had a serious drug problem at the time. We all joke about how he was the guy placing pacemakers INSIDE patients in the OR . . . because if you know him, it would totally scare the shit out of you that he had this responsibility. His own wife doesn't trust him to watch the kids by himself.

I'm a little jaded about being a consistent top performer in pharma, missed all of 2 days of work in 15 years, did what I said I was going to do, turned everything in on time, did everything they asked, made my manager look good, adapted to change and handled everything seamlessly . . . and the 20-something guys I worked with (and trained to do the job) who always had hangovers, rushed to work without shaving, missed work consistently, had to be bailed out all the time, went to the gym during work hours, thought you could do a presentation to upper management on a piece of looseleaf paper, never did one effect sales call, and hung around Starbucks all day talking on the phone with friends STILL have a job. And THEY'LL probably get those device jobs. Because somehow, they're 'likeable' and the world makes accommodations for their faults.

It's just the way it is. So wake up, white women! You're just not that likeable or desirable, and the sooner you realize it, get honest with yourself, the better off you'll be.
 




Anonymous said:
I'm one of the almost exclusively 'women over 40' (only 1 guy, all the rest women) who were let go in the Northeast last year. Curious, no?

It's true that there's an incredible bias against pharma sales when you're looking for a new job. I recommend repacking yourself as Account Manager, because pharma sales truly is more of an account management job and the skill sets line right up.

At all the Lee Hecht Harrison (the outplacement services you get) meetings, it's 90% white men in their 50's. They are having the worst time finding new work, even in high demand industries like finance and IT. So it could be worse. Being a white woman in your 40's is second from the bottom.

I have to laugh at the irony of interviews for device or surgical products. I recently had an informal/informational one at the outplacement office, and the HR person asked me if I have any OR experience. I told her no, but I had been in endoscopies and in-office procedures. When she frowned, I asked her what recommendations she might have for gaining OR experience . . . for example, should I go to nursing school?

She replied that they usually hired salespeople with 1-3 years experience (I have over 15) who had credentials like President's Club. So I asked her where these people had gotten their OR experience and she paused. She admitted that these salespeople had come from selling for companies like Adidas or Xerox.

So they clearly had no OR experience . . . but chances are they are hotshot asshole 25 year old guys. Who probably will do the job for 1-2 years and then move on to another device company.

She thought I might faint in the OR. Really? Even doctors tell you that you can never tell who will or won't faint in the OR. Sometimes it's surprising.

So it's really just a bullshit preconceived notion, that you need OR experience or prior device sales. Somebody is getting these device jobs with NO experience at all in order to have it in the first place. I actually know a guy who sold pacemakers when he was 24 . . . he's a hotshot asshole who can't even tie his own shoes and had a serious drug problem at the time. We all joke about how he was the guy placing pacemakers INSIDE patients in the OR . . . because if you know him, it would totally scare the shit out of you that he had this responsibility. His own wife doesn't trust him to watch the kids by himself.

I'm a little jaded about being a consistent top performer in pharma, missed all of 2 days of work in 15 years, did what I said I was going to do, turned everything in on time, did everything they asked, made my manager look good, adapted to change and handled everything seamlessly . . . and the 20-something guys I worked with (and trained to do the job) who always had hangovers, rushed to work without shaving, missed work consistently, had to be bailed out all the time, went to the gym during work hours, thought you could do a presentation to upper management on a piece of looseleaf paper, never did one effect sales call, and hung around Starbucks all day talking on the phone with friends STILL have a job. And THEY'LL probably get those device jobs. Because somehow, they're 'likeable' and the world makes accommodations for their faults.

It's just the way it is. So wake up, white women! You're just not that likeable or desirable, and the sooner you realize it, get honest with yourself, the better off you'll be.
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You sound really cranky and unmanageable, no wonder you were canned. Take a pill and go have a nap.
 




Everyone in pharma works from 10 to 2. Not counting drive-time or meetings with friends from other companies or your own company. If a rep,be it specialty, hospital,etc. tells you they work a full day, they are the ones who are cheating the system and themselves. Everyone knows a rep who tells people they work from 8am to 6pm busting their tale.
 




Anonymous said:
Everyone in pharma works from 10 to 2. Not counting drive-time or meetings with friends from other companies or your own company. If a rep,be it specialty, hospital,etc. tells you they work a full day, they are the ones who are cheating the system and themselves. Everyone knows a rep who tells people they work from 8am to 6pm busting their tale.
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Thanks for that random, rambling input fucker. Did you really graduate from college?
 




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