I had the BALLS to leave pharma!

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anonymous said:
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Don't quit. You are definitely not alone in your feelings. I am almost 18 years in Pharma and have quit several times to try other things. The pay, the benefits, and the flexibility above all else sucked me right in. I have recently determined that I am going to quit focusing on all the things I hate about Pharma (the catering and dismissive offices, mainly, but followed up closely by micro management), and I have determined to look at it as a means to an end. The end, my friend, is awesome benefits for my family, a free car (I always chose the company car vs using my own), and the fairly stable pay. I wasn't meant to be a Pharma rep, just as none of us were probably meant to be. I have dreams that I am going to use the flexibility of Pharma to achieve. As much as I hate being a caterer, I can think of so many worse jobs for doing so much more than I do each and every day. Don't quit. I've hit the point you are at, and COVID made me really think about my life. You can be a rep and pursue your other dreams, so stick with it, but don't let it be all you do each day. Get some exercise, eat right, make sure your confidence is up, and go follow your dreams. Not a bad day gig if you really think about it. Don't quit.
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anonymous said:
Just don’t be a “Patriot” and participate in Domestic Terrorism like last week. Seems like you people are Radicalized and angry for some reason.
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That cop in the Senate where Pence just sat in his seat asked “Any chance I can get you guys to leave this place”?! What the fuck kind of BS that is?! And you’re asking why BLM protests and is pissed?
 












anonymous said:
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Don't quit. You are definitely not alone in your feelings. I am almost 18 years in Pharma and have quit several times to try other things. The pay, the benefits, and the flexibility above all else sucked me right in. I have recently determined that I am going to quit focusing on all the things I hate about Pharma (the catering and dismissive offices, mainly, but followed up closely by micro management), and I have determined to look at it as a means to an end. The end, my friend, is awesome benefits for my family, a free car (I always chose the company car vs using my own), and the fairly stable pay. I wasn't meant to be a Pharma rep, just as none of us were probably meant to be. I have dreams that I am going to use the flexibility of Pharma to achieve. As much as I hate being a caterer, I can think of so many worse jobs for doing so much more than I do each and every day. Don't quit. I've hit the point you are at, and COVID made me really think about my life. You can be a rep and pursue your other dreams, so stick with it, but don't let it be all you do each day. Get some exercise, eat right, make sure your confidence is up, and go follow your dreams. Not a bad day gig if you really think about it. Don't quit.
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Thank you and really good perspective. I needed it. The next layoff is just around the corner and you’re right - enjoy what’s great about it and let the rest go. And use the “free time” wisely and be thankful for it. I also delegated and will have office staff pick up their own lunches in the future, if it’s virtual.
 






anonymous said:
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Don't quit. You are definitely not alone in your feelings. I am almost 18 years in Pharma and have quit several times to try other things. The pay, the benefits, and the flexibility above all else sucked me right in. I have recently determined that I am going to quit focusing on all the things I hate about Pharma (the catering and dismissive offices, mainly, but followed up closely by micro management), and I have determined to look at it as a means to an end. The end, my friend, is awesome benefits for my family, a free car (I always chose the company car vs using my own), and the fairly stable pay. I wasn't meant to be a Pharma rep, just as none of us were probably meant to be. I have dreams that I am going to use the flexibility of Pharma to achieve. As much as I hate being a caterer, I can think of so many worse jobs for doing so much more than I do each and every day. Don't quit. I've hit the point you are at, and COVID made me really think about my life. You can be a rep and pursue your other dreams, so stick with it, but don't let it be all you do each day. Get some exercise, eat right, make sure your confidence is up, and go follow your dreams. Not a bad day gig if you really think about it. Don't quit.
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This!
 






"Don't quit. You are definitely not alone in your feelings. I am almost 18 years in Pharma and have quit several times to try other things. The pay, the benefits, and the flexibility above all else sucked me right in. I have recently determined that I am going to quit focusing on all the things I hate about Pharma (the catering and dismissive offices, mainly, but followed up closely by micro management), and I have determined to look at it as a means to an end. The end, my friend, is awesome benefits for my family, a free car (I always chose the company car vs using my own), and the fairly stable pay. I wasn't meant to be a Pharma rep, just as none of us were probably meant to be. I have dreams that I am going to use the flexibility of Pharma to achieve. As much as I hate being a caterer, I can think of so many worse jobs for doing so much more than I do each and every day. Don't quit. I've hit the point you are at, and COVID made me really think about my life. You can be a rep and pursue your other dreams, so stick with it, but don't let it be all you do each day. Get some exercise, eat right, make sure your confidence is up, and go follow your dreams. Not a bad day gig if you really think about it. Don't quit."

To the OP, nice post! However, if you stick around long enough, you won't have to make the decision to quit - they'll make the decision for you by laying you off. Or, you'll get a new manager who makes your situation so intolerable that you'll be forced out. And, typically it will be difficult for you to secure a new rep gig to continue your ride on the Pharma rollercoaster (especially if you're an older more experienced rep). Such is the current state of Pharma. Due to the volatility and job insecurity in this declining industry, my advice to all is: Have a back up plan!
 






I worked for 32 years in this industry, and was “forced out” (thankfully, actually downsized). Like just about everything in life, there are pros and cons to staying. I felt overpaid and vulnerable for the last 15 years, but by then it was too late (in my mind) to think about something else. My suggestions are that if you really hate pharma then get out, and if you want to stay in, find a specialty position as it will pay better and will likely offer more options going forward. The key is to manage your mental mindset and finances to ensure your stress level is ok. I didn’t do such a good job in the first aspect, and wish I could do a do over it that regard as overall the pay, benefits and job were great.
 






I left pharma in 2012. I went back to school for a masters, then wound up taking a few years off with young kids and moving for my husbands job, and it took me a while (over a year) to get a job, between trying to transition my career out of sales and with a job gap of several years. Ive been in the corporate world for 2 years in marketing.

I absolutely love not being a rep, and I would never go back. My hours aren’t bad, and with WFH there’s flexibility in my schedule just like medical sales. I don’t have a company car, but post-pandemic, there are so many remote jobs that commuting and wear and tear won’t be an issue. My current position is a bit underpaid (full package says $100k, but that includes stock options depended upon the board’s metrics they pull out of their behind), but I’m currently interviewing for jobs paying $120k plus options & benefits.

Any time you are getting paid, it’s work, and there will always be BS, but I wouldn’t go back to sales with the instability and lack of respect. I’m trying to get into the clinical trials space and just finished a project management certification (PMP), and there’s a ton of growth in clinical trials, genomics and cell & gene. Go where the growth is.
 






anonymous said:
I left pharma in 2012. I went back to school for a masters, then wound up taking a few years off with young kids and moving for my husbands job, and it took me a while (over a year) to get a job, between trying to transition my career out of sales and with a job gap of several years. Ive been in the corporate world for 2 years in marketing.

I absolutely love not being a rep, and I would never go back. My hours aren’t bad, and with WFH there’s flexibility in my schedule just like medical sales. I don’t have a company car, but post-pandemic, there are so many remote jobs that commuting and wear and tear won’t be an issue. My current position is a bit underpaid (full package says $100k, but that includes stock options depended upon the board’s metrics they pull out of their behind), but I’m currently interviewing for jobs paying $120k plus options & benefits.

Any time you are getting paid, it’s work, and there will always be BS, but I wouldn’t go back to sales with the instability and lack of respect. I’m trying to get into the clinical trials space and just finished a project management certification (PMP), and there’s a ton of growth in clinical trials, genomics and cell & gene. Go where the growth is.
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You're a moron. You're at your ceiling. Good luck with your shitty online degree.
 






anonymous said:
OP here: I never say never, but I don’t think I could go back. I thought I was going to punch my boss.
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i am at that point right now. every conversation is contentious and on the cusp of turning violent. the guy is younger than me, has less experience and literally has no idea what class of medicine we sell but then has the balls to give me feedback on my messaging. he can't answer basic questions but was a manager at some other place so therefor is superior in every way, right? but the whole industry is like this. the managers whip the reps because their even less important middle manager regional directors are getting heat from the national manager. three levels of managers for every representative. does every industry work this way? what are these people managing other than their expense reports. this industry is full of make believe wanna be important leaders who could not manage their own businesses if they tried. i know several who have failed retail ventures, frozen yogurt shops, life coaching businesses and such because it turns out what they believed was business management was actually just people supervising. we clock in and out and they approve it. stop trying to be more than what the job requires. and the regionals. why are they necessary? will the manager's feeble mind explode if they get information directly from the national director? who even decides these regions? like why does the west region always include texas? as if texas and california are exactly the same medical landscape and deserving of one very important individual to oversee the critical flow of information received from the mythical home office. the facade of this job makes me sad on the daily. i hope you have succeeded because i am about to just walk off the job and start working as a real estate agent or something. hell, i'll even flip burgers. i just can't fake this another day.
 






anonymous said:
Resurrecting this thread. I had an existential crisis this week when a catering order for a virtual lunch splatted all over the company car. I was delivering food to a lunch wherein I could walk in to leave the food but then had to connect virtually...while I was sitting in the parking lot. That one minor event, built upon layers and layers of other nonsense has about cracked me.

I am 18 years in, laid off twice in my tenure, and just plain tired of the game. Manager and the people I work with are truly awesome people. I just have reached a point where… I don’t know what I’m doing. I don’t like what I am doing. I don’t feel like what I do really matter. And half the time I feel like I’m robbing people. Not doing anything wrong per se; I’m working the system as it is set up. But it’s just so unfulfilling. Except financially.

Do I quit in the middle of a pandemic? Will you? Does a job have to be fulfilling or am I having some version of a midlife crisis? A pandemic crisis? Yea I know - people will beat up my post yet I don’t mind being vulnerable to it. Maybe it’ll help.
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100% to your post! it's as if you are reading my mind. i literally cannot handle being a part of this circus anymore. the whole system exists to profit off of sick patients who require chronic medications. i think it is an existential crisis for me because i know that i will be a patient who might need a life saving drug someday. we all will. but what really haunts me is the idea that when i am much older and in need of my medications, i will remember that i contributed to and benefited from the fleecing of the masses because i won't be able to afford my ridiculous copay. the whole system is flawed and needs to be resurrected as a true medical science industry. work with physicians and scientists to discover innovations that could benefit society in meaningful ways rather than take an existing drug and extending it's patent with a new delivery system. the lazy profiteering is frightening and i am unable to fake it anymore. however, i can't seem to land an interview outside of this industry. there are a lot of unfavorable stereotypes about pharma reps that will be difficult to overcome. i have had two very successful interviews recently that got offers but for salaries that were hard to swallow. my entitlement keeps creeping up on me and i am trying to weigh the pros and cons but keep coming back to how much i hate it here. anyway, thank you for your post. really.
 






And as we learn the news of yet more industry layoffs over the past week or two (Exact Sciences and Takeda come to mind), there is further proof that the industry remains as volatile as ever, and that there is absolutely no job security (a few may beat the odds and remain employed for years at their companies, but they are the anomalies - many will be lucky to last 1-2 years before being cut or driven off by a sociopathic manager). Here is more evidence (a recent Cafe post from the Takeda board):

This is just sad. Look, I understand the need to reduce the head count. It’s business and we had too many reps in this current environment and the future is a small sales force requirement. However, to lay off this many reps (and many great reps) then turn around and post 63 openings simply tells you all you need to know about this place. Their “culture” call yesterday was a joke. They just don’t get it and are too ignorant to see how moves like this define their culture. We are a number here and that’s it. They really don’t even care about your performance or what you contribute to the organization. If they did and really knew who their “good” reps were they would have used this as an opportunity to cut the ones that wanted to go and eliminated the ones that were just a warm body in a territory. Instead they let go according to them “the beloved specialty rep” and promoted the primary care rep that barely leaves their house. Some people were wanting out and others were really hoping to stay and working to be positive and change the culture. It’s business and I know they have to cut while balancing the legal side of the layoff but these people are to incompetent to figure out how to minimize risk and keep talent. Or the more obvious is they simply don’t care. I get the business side. I really do. However, I don’t see how the top leaders look in the mirror at night knowing how their was no human input given and how unfair many of these layoffs have been. Until they address that component (which takes a lot more effort) their culture will never be right. As long as they keep lying and having senior leadership telling lies they will never change the culture. So in a very long answer….why the hell would you even want to apply for an opening in this division? It’s still in trouble so you buy yourself a year or two at best. Move on and get away from the toxicity. I promise this isn’t normal.
 












anonymous said:
Being a Pharma rep is like being a Bull Rider - the rides are short with painful endings. And hopefully you've got a supportive clown in your corner.
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51 and riding the bull one more time! Have just over 20 years. Successful. Own some real estate. Big pharma mostly -now trying smaller company, larger territory, no overlay/counterpart. Burnt out and had just enough to retire- but a good friend called. Will be making over $200K again -figure I’ve got a few more years in me! Wish me luck friends!
 






anonymous said:
Being a Pharma rep is like being a Bull Rider - the rides are short with painful endings. And hopefully you've got a supportive clown in your corner.
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great post.
To me, its more like being an adult porno actor. you stick it in and then call it "work".

Seriously, I think most of you that advise people stay in these toxic jobs for the money are absolutely crazy. Sure, the money is good. But, when you make life all about money, you are definitely headed in a bad direction.

Most of you, however, have set up your life so that you need the money (you actually don't), so you stay on and continue to work for one of the most (probably the most) corrupt industries on the planet. Your soul will certainly suffer for this decision.

There are tons of good sales jobs out there, outside of the industry too. Do your research and get out. Especially if you are younger and have many years of work ahead of you.
 






anonymous said:
51 and riding the bull one more time! Have just over 20 years. Successful. Own some real estate. Big pharma mostly -now trying smaller company, larger territory, no overlay/counterpart. Burnt out and had just enough to retire- but a good friend called. Will be making over $200K again -figure I’ve got a few more years in me! Wish me luck friends!
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You are not "successful" because you have had the same job for 20 years or because you accumulated some money.

Not trying to be a jerk here, but think about it.
 


















anonymous said:
My transition story is in the making. Left over a month ago (after over 20 years) and am pursing other career opportunities (not sales). I will probably make less than I did in pharma, yet my pharma friends seem to be jealous that I had the balls to leave.

They make comments about how much they are making (I left a month ago, not 20 years ago) and how you can’t leave that kind of money. Meanwhile, they are all angry, depressed and having nervous breakdowns. I choose to save my sanity and leave but it seems mysery loves company. They are about to get dumped.

Be happy for people who take the initiative to have a more sane life. Too many haters in this industry.
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The money in pharma is very good anymore.
 












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