Has the culture changed here?

[Anonymous]

Sorry, but there are a myriad of legit and reasonable explanations senior reps are insulted and biased against hiring pharma reps with no OR experience straight into ISI! These toddlers need to go to Covidien, Ethicon, BSC, or another great device training program so they can cut their baby teeth!!

In the Northeast, a 26-year pharma rep (female) was hired as a Clinical Sales Associate. NOTE: NOT a CSR-role, a JUNIOR role in which she was "passed around" to all the other CSRs who had a million other things to do instead of training a newbie! Granted, she was nice enough - but she had ZERO device training, knowledge or experience. It didn't help that she looked young (baby face) -so she looked 20!! It looked like all the reps were allowing a little sister or in some cases (daughter) to tag-along on surgeries. Green as green could be - she didn't know whom to speak with about getting scrubs, access, surgical schedules, credentialling info, access to RepTrax or whatever vendor system was used...Seriously....HOW can you justify the TIME spent on training this new hire when there MUST be more qualified reps that interviewed?

Early on, while observing cases at a highly regarded (flagship) teaching institution, she admitted that she had NO clue what a sterile field was before coming to ISI! Seriously, that's just unacceptable. To be THAT in over your head? That's not fair to anyone! WHY would ISI want to set her up for failure like that? The surgeons were pissed, the robotic team/coordinator felt like THEY were un-important since they were given such a rookie rep! And let's remember - at the end of the day - it's the PATIENT and family that deserve to have a qualified/competent/CLINICAL expert in the case. NOT someone who can't identify what's sterile or where to stand in a case observation.

So, that's an assessment of how some pharma reps can't hack the CLINICAL Sale. Shall we now bullet point the incompetence on the CAPITAL sale?? Seriously, selling drugs/dinner programs is NOT a CAPITAL sales process. Period. Unless you've actually been a hunter/farmer/qualifier of leads - how the *&^% are these folks going to help collaborate with the the ASM/ASD to justify costs/upgrades to the health system's CEO/CFO/CMO/Etc? Pharma folks JUST don't have the chops/best practices to sell to these folks. Period.

If ISI continues to hire straight from Pharma reps, they'll reap what they sow. They really should hire reps with at least 2-3 solid years of device experience first. Sound investments that have properly set expectations typically pay off.

I have worked in the northeast for over three years and we have never had a female csa.

 

[Anonymous]

My guess is that she's either no longer at ISI or maybe she's now a CSR if still there. Nonetheless, she came to ISI as a CSA in the Philly-suburbs area. Or, perhaps that territory/region is considered the Mid-Atlantic and not the Northeast? No matter, it's a true story. Again, she was a very nice gal. Just NOT at all what you'd consider qualified for the position. Given the fact that there's ususally a plethora of qualified candidates in large/metropolitan areas, it makes you wonder WHY ISI would hire pharma reps with not a shred of device experience? Recipe for disaster.

 

[Anonymous]

Da vinci specialist?

 

[Anonymous]

Da vinci specialist?

 

[Anonymous]

My colleauge who was hired directly from pharma was promoted at IS and was extremely successful there. Any hospital rep worth their salt can figure out what they need to know about the OR fast. Only the cream of the crop get into hospital sales. We know how hospitals work, and we have existing contacts throughout the hospital. Clearly IS made the mistake of hiring a field sales rep.

 

[Anonymous]

A 42 year old career pharma rep? This is not the company for you and that's ok! It's not "simply disgusting". It just wouldn't be a good fit. Why waste your time and ours. I spent a couple years in pharma right out of college and then advanced into med device sales with Boston Scientific and Stryker. I spent 5 years working hard in the OR and learning how to be successful in that environment. I've had 3 great years so far w ISI as a Clinical Rep and am glad I didn't come here right out of pharma. I realize we have hired a few drug reps over the past couple years but they are exceptions to the usual rule.

The culture HAS changed here over the past year or so. We've hired better managers and promoted more from within as opposed to always going to other companies (i.e. Covidien, Ethicon, Medtronic....) for management talent. I believe we have a long way to go in some regions and I bet most of the negative ranting on this thread comes from those regions. I work in the Mountain Region and know that the SouthEast and SouthCentral regions also have significantly improved their tenure and culture. Those regions have excellent clinical teams and always seem to be the ones recognized at meetings.

My advice if you're looking to join our sales team is to find out all you can about the Clinical Sales Manager in that region and the team's performance over the past year. Don't take what a lot of ex-employees on this thread have said and write off ISI in general. I have loved it here for the past 3 years and hope to stay for a long time.

Totally agree with this! Well said

 

[Anonymous]

Good for you. Glad to hear that some are still happy at ISI.
Just watch your back, ride the wave and scrub your cases with pristine backup!
However, if you're there more than 3 years??? You're at risk for body snatching. Don't say you "didn't see it coming". They'll replace you tomorrow with a Pharma Rep that they can pay less, and tolerate micromanaging so they can get into devices.
ABL! (Always Be Looking!)

 

[Anonymous]

All you holier than though "device reps" can F off. It's funny you think you're so superior to Pharma. It's just like specialty or oncology, cardiology specialists. They say its not primary care and they have no skills or contacts, etc. it's all a big joke. ALL these reps started in PC Pharma to start, don't try to sound like your better than others. I made close to $200k in Pharma with NO stress, made a ton on options, no micromanagement. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

 

[Anonymous]

All you holier than though "device reps" can F off. It's funny you think you're so superior to Pharma. It's just like specialty or oncology, cardiology specialists. They say its not primary care and they have no skills or contacts, etc. it's all a big joke. ALL these reps started in PC Pharma to start, don't try to sound like your better than others. I made close to $200k in Pharma with NO stress, made a ton on options, no micromanagement. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

I have friends that sell specialty pharma, they are sharp professionals and they make a good living. For every one of them, there are 10 brainless twits schlepping samples around and catering lunches.

 

[Anonymous]

I have friends that sell specialty pharma, they are sharp professionals and they make a good living. For every one of them, there are 10 brainless twits schlepping samples around and catering lunches.

It's no different in device, and still no different than at Intuitive. Trust me. There are plenty of reps that play the game very well, and do barely anything to get by.

 

[Anonymous]

WOW I will pay more in taxes than than that . Pass the pipe BRO

 

[Anonymous]

Seems like there are several open positions now in the South? After reading through these posts I am even more confused.

 

[Anonymous]

If you are making any career decisions based off of the miserable people posting on cafe pharma, you are making a big mistake. Take these posts for what they are...disgruntled, lazy people that were let go, for doing exactly this, posting on cafe pharma instead of working. Come on here for entertainment and a few laughs, but certainly not to make any serious career decisions. That would be a huge mistake.

 

[Anonymous]

Totally agree with this! Well said

Really? The mountain area is a joke? CD hires weak managers and doesn't care about his people. He tried for a bit after a mass exodus from AZ, but his true colors came through. Some talented reps that are all looking for a job. They are all sick of the negative feel. I'm sure it won't get any better after the poor numbers thrown up around the country. More heads will roll

 

[Anonymous]

If you are making any career decisions based off of the miserable people posting on cafe pharma, you are making a big mistake. Take these posts for what they are...disgruntled, lazy people that were let go, for doing exactly this, posting on cafe pharma instead of working. Come on here for entertainment and a few laughs, but certainly not to make any serious career decisions. That would be a huge mistake.

OK, which are you? Lazy, disgruntled... Look beyond your rose colored glasses. Thia place blows. Not what it used to be...

 

[Anonymous]

If you are making any career decisions based off of the miserable people posting on cafe pharma, you are making a big mistake. Take these posts for what they are...disgruntled, lazy people that were let go, for doing exactly this, posting on cafe pharma instead of working. Come on here for entertainment and a few laughs, but certainly not to make any serious career decisions. That would be a huge mistake.

I bet this is someone in HR trying to salvage this company's reputation.

 

[Anonymous]

So true...I had the same exact experience with ISI. I was there for 5 years and one day got an unsuspecting call out of the blue. -spot on-

I was "forced out" a while back. I had been a high-performing rep for about 3 years and NEVER thought I'd be on the chopping block. That was reserved for OTHERS that couldn't hack it, "phoned it in", or were under-performers. Well, that just wasn't the case in my situation. I'm told ISI still deploys the "End-of-Quarter Employee Cleansing" tactic to completely unsuspecting individuals. I've been told by a Sunnyvale insider that a total of 9 were chopped on that same termination date. CSRs, CSMs, ASMs, ASDs - all good people that have families and truly "didn't see it coming". I was NEVER on a performance plan, I trained countless new hires without ever getting the title FST (Field Sales Trainer) or the bonus ($) that's attached to train newbies. I did the right things day-in and day-out. I was often seen as a leader by management and had a "can-do" attitude. I enjoyed the job (warts and all) and thought I'd be there for at least another 3 years (or until I truly burned out). Now that the dust has settled, I've found a new job that I really enjoy. I've found much needed "balance" in my life (family/friend time) and honestly don't miss ISI one bit.

That said, for those considering ISI as a career choice, here's the upside:
1. Money - $220K low - $278K high (5 accounts, included upgrades/new systems).
2. Selling Opportunities - No other device job will give you access to C-Suite executives, and world-class surgeons. Period. These "teachable moments" build your skill set, confidence and results. You'll take these experiences with you for the rest of your career. Bonus? You'll NEVER fear interviewing again. I mean seriously...once you close a $2.5M deal to a health system you thought would NEVER buy?? Landing your next gig is like taking candy from a baby! (As long as you're humble of course) - which many ISI folks lack!
3. Outcomes - I know, I know...many feel daVinci surgery is "fairy-dust" or marketing. I've seen first-hand from best-in-class surgeons, patients, and loved ones to the contrary. To see grown men (surgeons) get "giddy" when they have access and visualization to structures they've only seen in textbooks? Pretty cool.

All in all, my years at ISI were good ones. I enjoyed the challenges, money, and product.
That said, the culture is horrific. When I left, they were hiring 26 year old Pharma reps with NO device experience. None. Don't even know what a sterile field is?? Scary. Surgeons would make snide comments that ISI was going "downhill" in rep talent. Agreed, can't argue with that point! It was just starting to get pretty crazy with the micro-mangaging. I escaped it for the most part, but had heard from the West Coast folks it was really terrible. I always felt pressure to "add" cases (GYN dvH/dvSC anyone??)...we'll leave it at that. Reps get "fired" for it, but not the managers and directors? Whatever....not my problem anymore! But, one wonders when that ^%$# will hit the fan? I know several reps that "pulled" cases from next quarter into the existing quarter just to meet the forecasted "blood" number! If you're stuck with a CSM that leads by fear (rather than example) - even the the most honest reps "do what they gotta do" (rob from Peter to pay Paul) to ensure your CSM makes his/her buckets!

Bottom line: I'd have a daVinci procedure if needed, and would recommend the technology but NOT the job~! Life's too short for that much misery!