Why does everyone hate the training department ?

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Anonymous

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Maybe because we have not seen a significant clinical training initiative in 10 years ??? We used to be the apple of the industry eye due to the clinical training we received. Now that department runs from clinical training like it is out of compliance. How the heck are we supposed to field a credible field force that brings value to physicians and gains access as a result when that department provides zero clinical training ?


Who is guarding that misadventure ? What is the spend, and what value is the field force getting from that department ?

Signed: One POed CTM
 






Dear PO'ed CTM,
You hit the nail on the head when you mentioned value. Your company obvious believes money spent on clinical training of reps does not represent value and, they may be right! Your days may be numbered.
Sincerely,
A Shareholder
 






Not to mention, as a stockholder and an ancient Merck rep, I do not want to see money wasted training the Barbie and Ken models in anything clinical. It won't stick. May be a one-day seminar on flirting with physicians without exposing your boobs or how to look GQ will suffice? Conduct them at Motel 6 to save $$ please.
 






the last 7-8 years have witnessed a significant "dumbing down" of the sales force. the merck rep of today is not the merck rep of 15-20 years ago. not even close. all the talk of ncm or "partnering" with physicians is just lip service. the reps with true "clinical expertise" are long gone, downsized. I knew things had changed about 5 years ago when I got a manager who continually critiqued my product discussions as "too technical". I finally figured out that what she meant was "too technical" for her. On field visits she had no idea what the Dr. and I were talking about. merck reps were once apart from other pharma reps in thier enhanced cliniical knowledge. now a merck rep is just like every other salesperson that walks through the door. they don't seem know much more than the average receptionist. clinical knowledge and training has taken a backseat to compliance and policy tests. the lawyers are in charge. welcome to post vioxx merck. so much for "evidence based" medicine.
 






Anonymous said:
the last 7-8 years have witnessed a significant "dumbing down" of the sales force. the merck rep of today is not the merck rep of 15-20 years ago. not even close. all the talk of ncm or "partnering" with physicians is just lip service. the reps with true "clinical expertise" are long gone, downsized. I knew things had changed about 5 years ago when I got a manager who continually critiqued my product discussions as "too technical". I finally figured out that what she meant was "too technical" for her. On field visits she had no idea what the Dr. and I were talking about. merck reps were once apart from other pharma reps in their enhanced clinical knowledge. now a merck rep is just like every other salesperson that walks through the door. they don't seem know much more than the average receptionist. clinical knowledge and training has taken a backseat to compliance and policy tests. the lawyers are in charge. welcome to post vioxx merck. so much for "evidence based" medicine.
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So true. But, as an older Merck rep with not much time left before retirement, I can tell you the newer "dumber" reps can B.S. They can talk. They know how to throw a good party. They know how to flirt. I can't do all of these which is making me obsolete. Yes, they know how to dress for success too.
 






OMG the training department 10 years now a debacle as a center of excellence. We used to be able to use high functioning reps and CTMs as role models/mentors. Great result. We used to have routine medical education offerings to keep us up to speed. The current leadership in that department gave us Milestone Training (the 2 million dollar fiasco), QCS, CBS, All dismal failures. We need a physician to take over the department if we are evr to get back to the product and disease experts we once were.
 






Great post. If we have any chance of maintaining access we have to step up the clinical training. Market research shows that physicians will see medical liaison type personnel from pharma. That is the future, and it has to happen now. That department has been a joke for years. Can anyone say money pit ??? Can anyone say untimely, irrelevant and out of touch ???

Time to clean out the garbage and do something new.
 






Anonymous said:
the last 7-8 years have witnessed a significant "dumbing down" of the sales force. the merck rep of today is not the merck rep of 15-20 years ago. not even close. all the talk of ncm or "partnering" with physicians is just lip service. the reps with true "clinical expertise" are long gone, downsized. I knew things had changed about 5 years ago when I got a manager who continually critiqued my product discussions as "too technical". I finally figured out that what she meant was "too technical" for her. On field visits she had no idea what the Dr. and I were talking about. merck reps were once apart from other pharma reps in thier enhanced cliniical knowledge. now a merck rep is just like every other salesperson that walks through the door. they don't seem know much more than the average receptionist. clinical knowledge and training has taken a backseat to compliance and policy tests. the lawyers are in charge. welcome to post vioxx merck. so much for "evidence based" medicine.
Click to expand...

Some managers want the big talking, good looking reps who flirt, laugh and smile. A BA in elementary ed preferred over a less lively ex-nurse with actual experience working on the floors. Our big mistake was looking at personality and fliar over the clincial substance. When medical people become reps they soon discover most of what they offer is not important anymore.
 






I doubt didactic training will ever return. Milestone training was a nice way to say we want to pretend we still value training but want to do it cheap and on your own (personal) time. This is why physicians would talk to the older, better trained Merck reps while see the newer ones for flirting only.
 






For starters, how about their clueless? The recent excercise with high dose simvastatin is a classic example. Who cares? We are waisting 5 work day to spend doing this silly crap. Most of these punks were not in the field for very long to even learn the ropes, or they have been back there so long that they no longer know what it like in the trenches.

How about these stupid monday morning training teleconferences? What another waste of time.
 






Anonymous said:
Some managers want the big talking, good looking reps who flirt, laugh and smile. A BA in elementary ed preferred over a less lively ex-nurse with actual experience working on the floors. Our big mistake was looking at personality and fliar over the clinical substance. When medical people become reps they soon discover most of what they offer is not important anymore.
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This is why my good looking colleague froze when a doc asked her about the basic design of a reprint she was using, what is double blinded versus single blinded, and what is cross over, etc. She could not flirt away the question and the discussion went down hill. It is a waste to spend money on reps that Merck chose for look and personality but not for knowledge/intelligence. Nice legs. Nice boobs. But what is a HMG CoA reductase inhibitor? Not sure. Can I submit a professional information request for you?
 






Anonymous said:
Maybe because we have not seen a significant clinical training initiative in 10 years ??? We used to be the apple of the industry eye due to the clinical training we received. Now that department runs from clinical training like it is out of compliance. How the heck are we supposed to field a credible field force that brings value to physicians and gains access as a result when that department provides zero clinical training ?


Who is guarding that misadventure ? What is the spend, and what value is the field force getting from that department ?

Signed: One POed CTM
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Thwe training department has become a dumping ground for job protection and managment clones. Just look at M. Meehan and Tris Wetzel neither have done a thing in years that a vendor hasen't produced. High six figures and no talent, what a waste
 






What training department? We still have one? All I know is I have to download my study aids on my computer and study by myself. My manager even knows we don't know the stuff as well as we should.....the expectations are much lower than when I started, but what can you expect in this environment? You get what you pay for....can't afford to fly everyone in for some real training, so just do the best you can...besides, why bother doing deep training when they move the sales force around and change responsibilities on a quarterly basis? The expectations are do more with fewer people....no time for training.
 












In all seriousness, we have to remove the senior leadership in that department. As you probably know, the current leadership is controlled by a collectiion of "instructional designers". Might as well be interior designers !!! The band 3 leadership in that department consists of no one that is familiar to us in sales/marketing. Gee, let me think about this. No sales, no clinical, no marketing experience.....in an industry that is demanding business savvy and clinical expertise in order to gain access to physicans.

I agree with POed CTM above....Why should one cog in the wheel get a ten year free ride at the expense of the rest of us. Hand the department back to field sales people and demand some accountability.
 






Anonymous said:
What training department? We still have one? All I know is I have to download my study aids on my computer and study by myself. My manager even knows we don't know the stuff as well as we should.....the expectations are much lower than when I started, but what can you expect in this environment? You get what you pay for....can't afford to fly everyone in for some real training, so just do the best you can...besides, why bother doing deep training when they move the sales force around and change responsibilities on a quarterly basis? The expectations are do more with fewer people....no time for training.
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What is the duration of Merck's basic training these days? I changed professions around 10 yrs ago and at that time it was 7-8 weeks.
 






Anonymous said:
This is why my good looking colleague froze when a doc asked her about the basic design of a reprint she was using, what is double blinded versus single blinded, and what is cross over, etc. She could not flirt away the question and the discussion went down hill. It is a waste to spend money on reps that Merck chose for look and personality but not for knowledge/intelligence. Nice legs. Nice boobs. But what is a HMG CoA reductase inhibitor? Not sure. Can I submit a professional information request for you?
Click to expand...

Oh!....I was I patient once, so I know what its like to take care for patients!
 






Anonymous said:
So true. But, as an older Merck rep with not much time left before retirement, I can tell you the newer "dumber" reps can B.S. They can talk. They know how to throw a good party. They know how to flirt. I can't do all of these which is making me obsolete. Yes, they know how to dress for success too.
Click to expand...

So true, I'm another soon to be obsolete. From awards to bottom dweller. Success looks different these days...cant love that NCM...it will put a lot of good older reps out.....can only wonder if the 50 plus managers will be going too.
 






Anonymous said:
So true, I'm another soon to be obsolete. From awards to bottom dweller. Success looks different these days...cant love that NCM...it will put a lot of good older reps out.....can only wonder if the 50 plus managers will be going too.
Click to expand...

The happy thought is I will be retiring with a larger pension than my manager who has sold his soul and wave the NCM flag. That will be ironic when Merck either eliminates the pension plan or keep screwing around with the calculation.
 






Come on people, Man Up. Instead of whining about NCM and lack of training, please post constructive solutions to what the NCM has done to us, done to the industry. Fact, we were Fortune 500 # 1 six years in row. Fact, we were rated as one of the best, clinically astute sales forces in the industry. Fact, Merck reps had better access than anybody.

If you are going to stay in the industry, If you have any self-worth left at all, stand up for a needed change in our training. No one can take solid sales, market and clinical experience away from you. It translates...it translates to other positions, it translates to other organizations. Demand a change now. Market research shows that physicians are seeing well trained reps that bring value....We have to get our edge back. Get rid of the clique that is leading the training department.
 






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