What impact has Praxbind had on Pradaxa in the US?

[anonymous]

I sell Pradaxa in another country & am just curious as to what's been going on with sales in the US since the antidote was approved. Thanks!

 

[anonymous]

I sell Pradaxa in another country & am just curious as to what's been going on with sales in the US since the antidote was approved. Thanks!

Hasn't meant shit. Cards here can justify any drug they use here. if their fav was P then great it's nice to have a reversal. if you use X, well once a day trumps having a reversal and a short life means who cares if they don't have a reversal anyway. if you write E well with way,way, way lower bleeding profile then who cares about a reversal. No one uses S so who cares. 50% of market is Warfarin anyway because it's dirt cheap (US$4 bucks vs US$30-75 bucks a month).

Do patients care - hell yes, but in US you really have no choice to do whatever the Doc chooses anyway so it doesn't matter.

Hope that helps.

 

[anonymous]

Hasn't meant shit. Cards here can justify any drug they use here. if their fav was P then great it's nice to have a reversal. if you use X, well once a day trumps having a reversal and a short life means who cares if they don't have a reversal anyway. if you write E well with way,way, way lower bleeding profile then who cares about a reversal. No one uses S so who cares. 50% of market is Warfarin anyway because it's dirt cheap (US$4 bucks vs US$30-75 bucks a month).

Do patients care - hell yes, but in US you really have no choice to do whatever the Doc chooses anyway so it doesn't matter.

Hope that helps.

Interesting to know...I guess docs just want to justify their choice as being the best no matter what, huh? Thanks for the info.

 

[anonymous]

guess PDX being the largest NOAC in NBRx scripts since PB launch doesn't count in how it's doing.. maybe you need to do a better job of selling to your Cards if they don't see the relevance of having PB available

 

[anonymous]

guess PDX being the largest NOAC in NBRx scripts since PB launch doesn't count in how it's doing.. maybe you need to do a better job of selling to your Cards if they don't see the relevance of having PB available

that was data ended 2 months out. that is not the case now. all the CARDs who feel that it would a difference are yes writting more pdx. however, nationwide share of market belie the problem. Gen Warf-45%, E - 23%, X-20%, P-8%. pdx, unfortunately, is the micardis of anti-coag. it's got efficacy out the ass in data but for reasons stated previously, it doesn't matter. until some bad stuff comes out about E then that will be the market leader, warf for those with bad insurance coverage, x for dvt and those who feel an afib needs a once a day because for some goofy reason, then where does that leave pdx? the one they choose 4th. having a reversal agent isn't as big apart of that decision making process as expected. jeez, look at the struggle it's been to get pb on at some hospitals 100%). hell, if you can't get an instituition that will lose millions ina simple lawsuit to get it stocked then why would you think ppb would make a difference to a cardiologist who is even further removed from a bleed event. i think some ppl thought it would be like shooting fish in a barrel, but thruth is that if they don't give a rats turd about the drug in the first place, then the answer has been ... meh, nice to know.

 

[anonymous]

0.0

Hasn't meant shit. Cards here can justify any drug they use here. if their fav was P then great it's nice to have a reversal. if you use X, well once a day trumps having a reversal and a short life means who cares if they don't have a reversal anyway. if you write E well with way,way, way lower bleeding profile then who cares about a reversal. No one uses S so who cares. 50% of market is Warfarin anyway because it's dirt cheap (US$4 bucks vs US$30-75 bucks a month).

Do patients care - hell yes, but in US you really have no choice to do whatever the Doc chooses anyway so it doesn't matter.

Hope that helps.

 

[anonymous]

I sell Pradaxa in another country & am just curious as to what's been going on with sales in the US since the antidote was approved. Thanks!

Not much. The Cards are recognizing that Even with Praxabind on board, Eliquis has lower bleeds and more effective. What would you choose for your patients?

 

[anonymous]

Not much. The Cards are recognizing that Even with Praxabind on board, Eliquis has lower bleeds and more effective. What would you choose for your patients?

More effective? How? It was delayed 2 years so the lower dose could be worked into the main trial along with the higher dose to get bleed rates lower.

Shitload of good that did.

The 1st class action lawsuit against eliquis was recently certified. They're all in the same boat.

I would want the 1 with a reversal if I had a bleed, but that's just me

 

[anonymous]

guess PDX being the largest NOAC in NBRx scripts since PB launch doesn't count in how it's doing.. maybe you need to do a better job of selling to your Cards if they don't see the relevance of having PB available

That is a gigantic crock of SHIT! Absolutely NO impact.

 

[anonymous]

More effective? How? It was delayed 2 years so the lower dose could be worked into the main trial along with the higher dose to get bleed rates lower.

Shitload of good that did.

The 1st class action lawsuit against eliquis was recently certified. They're all in the same boat.

I would want the 1 with a reversal if I had a bleed, but that's just me

+1

 

[anonymous]

Not much. The Cards are recognizing that Even with Praxabind on board, Eliquis has lower bleeds and more effective. What would you choose for your patients?

Go back to the Pfizer message board you pathetic dipshit. Yes, we are having layoffs here. GFY.

 

[anonymous]

Not much. The Cards are recognizing that Even with Praxabind on board, Eliquis has lower bleeds and more effective. What would you choose for your patients?

Ok, I'll bite. What is Eleekwus more effective than? Aspirin was only drug in a head to head E ever beat. Problem is, no one should ever use Asa for spaf in the first place, so being more effective than Asa is really no big whoop.

Is there some other trial they showed higher efficacy in? Or are you just talking out your ass because this is an anonymous, unregulated website?

Please don't say Aristotle because they were more people on E that had a ischemic stroke than warfarin. That, by definition, means it sadly was NOT more effective.

 

[anonymous]

Doctors want the 1 with the lowest bleed rates because they are so risk averse due to the ambulance chasing shyster lawyers that have ruined this country.

It should be common sense that anticoagulants increase bleeding. When you are trying to prevent a stroke, it's part of the deal. How many people have bled on Warfarin the past 60 years and not lived through the vitamin K FFP regimen? I bet it's a fuck ton of people but millions more didn't have a stroke and that is the whole point.

 

[anonymous]

Doctors want the 1 with the lowest bleed rates because they are so risk averse due to the ambulance chasing shyster lawyers that have ruined this country.

It should be common sense that anticoagulants increase bleeding. When you are trying to prevent a stroke, it's part of the deal. How many people have bled on Warfarin the past 60 years and not lived through the vitamin K FFP regimen? I bet it's a fuck ton of people but millions more didn't have a stroke and that is the whole point.

+1

 

[anonymous]

Ok, I'll bite. What is Eleekwus more effective than? Aspirin was only drug in a head to head E ever beat. Problem is, no one should ever use Asa for spaf in the first place, so being more effective than Asa is really no big whoop.

Is there some other trial they showed higher efficacy in? Or are you just talking out your ass because this is an anonymous, unregulated website?

Please don't say Aristotle because they were more people on E that had a ischemic stroke than warfarin. That, by definition, means it sadly was NOT more effective.

Guess you haven't read the article that was printed in Circulation back in January:

Conclusions—In real-world clinical practice, dabigatran is comparable with warfarin in preventing ischemic stroke among patients with nonvalvular atrial fibrillation. However, dabigatran is associated with a lower risk for intracranial bleeding relative to warfarin, but—particularly among the elderly—a greater risk for gastrointestinal bleeding. Bleeding outcomes from observational studies are consistent with those from the pivotal Randomized Evaluation of Long-Term Anticoagulation Therapy trial.

That ischemic stroke secondary endpoint message got you nothing but less and less market share...so much Kool-Aid...

 

[anonymous]

Guess you haven't read the article that was printed in Circulation back in January:

Conclusions—In real-world clinical practice, dabigatran is comparable with warfarin in preventing ischemic stroke among patients with nonvalvular atrial fibrillation. However, dabigatran is associated with a lower risk for intracranial bleeding relative to warfarin, but—particularly among the elderly—a greater risk for gastrointestinal bleeding. Bleeding outcomes from observational studies are consistent with those from the pivotal Randomized Evaluation of Long-Term Anticoagulation Therapy trial.

That ischemic stroke secondary endpoint message got you nothing but less and less market share...so much Kool-Aid...

What's holding Pradaxa down is the formulary coverage getting worse on large plans. We get the reversal agent, then it gets moved to tier 3 or gets taken off the preferred list !?!? Who is running this clown show?
Patients are getting put on X or E instead on a lot of part D plans. Our card gets them the 1st 30 day supply, then the patient sees how high our co-pays are then they switch. This is having obvious impact in large metropolitan areas with large public aid populations and big medicare areas. This company is in such deep shit that it can't afford the rebates our competitors can.

 

[anonymous]

Guess you haven't read the article that was printed in Circulation back in January:

Conclusions—In real-world clinical practice, dabigatran is comparable with warfarin in preventing ischemic stroke among patients with nonvalvular atrial fibrillation. However, dabigatran is associated with a lower risk for intracranial bleeding relative to warfarin, but—particularly among the elderly—a greater risk for gastrointestinal bleeding. Bleeding outcomes from observational studies are consistent with those from the pivotal Randomized Evaluation of Long-Term Anticoagulation Therapy trial.

That ischemic stroke secondary endpoint message got you nothing but less and less market share...so much Kool-Aid...

Guess you don't get a real-world observational trial is a pale substitute of a proscriptive Randomized Active controlled trial trial. Equilibrating these 2 shows me you drink your own company's kooky aid (nor have any idea what evidence based medicine is). You might recall dabi showed superior reductions in 2 large clinical trials.

 

[anonymous]

Hello my Pradaxa brethren, let's all save our breath and understand that this is not a clinical issue. Stop the madness over ischemic stroke, bleeds, reversal, etc. Much as BI chose to not play in the Silverscripts space with respiratory, so too has cardio brand CHOSEN to not play in their mkt. You're up against the big boys with Pfizer and J&J, and the will continue to crush you. Brand, you made your bed; now lie in it.

I have seen the pathetic efforts of my Cardspec peers pile on to our PCP lunches to sing the praises of Praxbind, which they will never use, to show that PDX is therefore "safer" and will hold the lawyers at bay. So sad that it has come to this.

 

[anonymous]

Hello my Pradaxa brethren, let's all save our breath and understand that this is not a clinical issue. Stop the madness over ischemic stroke, bleeds, reversal, etc. Much as BI chose to not play in the Silverscripts space with respiratory, so too has cardio brand CHOSEN to not play in their mkt. You're up against the big boys with Pfizer and J&J, and the will continue to crush you. Brand, you made your bed; now lie in it.

I have seen the pathetic efforts of my Cardspec peers pile on to our PCP lunches to sing the praises of Praxbind, which they will never use, to show that PDX is therefore "safer" and will hold the lawyers at bay. So sad that it has come to this.

The Cards write based on bleed first, stroke reduction last, and coverage in the middle. pxbind is part of number one but we lose it on the second. There isn't a week that goes by that I don't here of Noac bleeds and no one is exempt from this so at some point it will be written based on coverage first just like the arb's and ace's before.