Nobel Upper Management Needs To Take Responsibilty

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Anonymous said:
You are on crack cerec boy! Your abutment is shit and it cost more than $25 to mill plus the crappy Ti base thingy. I've been in a lot of labs lately and your BS inlab isn't even in the convo. Maybe you should partner with ID and complete your world conquest?? They also talk a lot of meaningless BS so it should be a great merger. In the mean time, FO! Isn't your branch manager calling to find out why you cost him his bonus again?
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Very funny response. A CEREC crown is made every 8 seconds in the US. CEREC has been out for 27 years and has been a tremendous clinical success during that time period. I saw the tiny Nobel booth at the NY meeting, and compared to a couple years ago, I'd say about 1/5 the size. Indicative of a slow market decline. There are thousands of labs using the CEREC Inlab to make abutments, crowns and bridges. The Procera model has failed, and labs are not buying the scanners. Dentists in their quest to cut costs are investing in systems that reduce their costs, and benefit the patients-i.e. CEREC and CEREC Inlab. The market for overpriced abutments is changing. Nobel and others have lost market share to Implant Direct and other low priced competitors. A few years back they laughed at the Niznick, now with an ever decreasing market share Nobel laughs at the prospect of self milled abutments. Lets continue this discussion in 3 years and see where the company is and how much of the restorative business has been lost to CAD/CAM chairside machines.
 




Anonymous said:
Very funny response. A CEREC crown is made every 8 seconds in the US. CEREC has been out for 27 years and has been a tremendous clinical success during that time period. I saw the tiny Nobel booth at the NY meeting, and compared to a couple years ago, I'd say about 1/5 the size. Indicative of a slow market decline. There are thousands of labs using the CEREC Inlab to make abutments, crowns and bridges. The Procera model has failed, and labs are not buying the scanners. Dentists in their quest to cut costs are investing in systems that reduce their costs, and benefit the patients-i.e. CEREC and CEREC Inlab. The market for overpriced abutments is changing. Nobel and others have lost market share to Implant Direct and other low priced competitors. A few years back they laughed at the Niznick, now with an ever decreasing market share Nobel laughs at the prospect of self milled abutments. Lets continue this discussion in 3 years and see where the company is and how much of the restorative business has been lost to CAD/CAM chairside machines.
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Indicative is a big word for a cerec rep. Heres a fact I'd like you to produce. How many crowns are made every 8 sec??? We would all love to know what market share you are claiming cerec has to other/all crowns produced!! 1% mayby 1.5% Niznick......really? Ok, what have you lost to E4D?? About the same argument. Be careful what you say, we're not all as dumb as you are. Fact is cerec is tiny in the lab and implant market. Hell, I have a clinical instructor for cerec in my market that wont put that abutment on his implant cases. we dont care what you think, all youre doing is repeating what youve been told. Produce the answer to my question and we can talk again.
 




10% of US doctors now have a CEREC machine in their office. The marketshare breakdown is 16,000 Cerec machines in the US, 800 E4D machines. The 10% of the offices that have CEREC do over 30% of the restorative volume in the US. It's the high volume offices that own this technology. As far as abutments the volume is significantly less at the moment but is about to change. The materials used to make these shitty crowns are the same materials made by the same companies the labs use to make Cad/cam crowns. eMax, Empress, Lava, etc. Nobel professes one visit imlant placement and immediate function, but your saying that's a bad model for crown and bridge traditional restorations? Ironic. If you prefer to have traditional impressions with trays and VPS, then have a temporary in your mouth for two weeks and then go back to for a second appt to get your new crown versus no impressin material, no temp and a permanent crown delivered in an hour, that's fine. People who are busy and making money don't like to prolong their dental visits. You sell the concept of Teeth in a Hour and Immediate Function, but can't stand the concept of crowns and veneers in an hour, funny.
 












Anonymous said:
10% of US doctors now have a CEREC machine in their office. The marketshare breakdown is 16,000 Cerec machines in the US, 800 E4D machines. The 10% of the offices that have CEREC do over 30% of the restorative volume in the US. It's the high volume offices that own this technology. As far as abutments the volume is significantly less at the moment but is about to change. The materials used to make these shitty crowns are the same materials made by the same companies the labs use to make Cad/cam crowns. eMax, Empress, Lava, etc. Nobel professes one visit imlant placement and immediate function, but your saying that's a bad model for crown and bridge traditional restorations? Ironic. If you prefer to have traditional impressions with trays and VPS, then have a temporary in your mouth for two weeks and then go back to for a second appt to get your new crown versus no impressin material, no temp and a permanent crown delivered in an hour, that's fine. People who are busy and making money don't like to prolong their dental visits. You sell the concept of Teeth in a Hour and Immediate Function, but can't stand the concept of crowns and veneers in an hour, funny.
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No one said anything about your business model being crappy only the ti base abutment. Your numbers are meaningless because most doctors use Cerec for chairside C&B which isnt really what we're talking about here. Cerec doc's will opt for a bridge instead of an implant. In addition, Cerec is partnering with implant companies now and we arent going to hand over our sales dollars to Patterson. Furthermore, most are using CAD/CAM to mill custom abutments which are stronger than what youre doing. Major manufactures arent going to sit by and watch as your abutmet causes implant failures. If you do a little more research you find everyone has a CAD/CAM system for milling abutments which allows for far more customization. Again, youre an after thought in the lab market which is where most implant abutments are made. So professor, lets hear your numbers on IMPLANT abutments and crowns since you are in fact on an implant board. Oh, congrats on lossing $100 million (on chairside units alone) over the last 6 years.....great job!!
 




It's only a tooth, Girls.

Why not use that anger and frustration on your womanfolk instead of strangers ?

You might even get a home cooked meal and the laundry done once-in-a-while.
 




Anonymous said:
No one said anything about your business model being crappy only the ti base abutment. Your numbers are meaningless because most doctors use Cerec for chairside C&B which isnt really what we're talking about here. Cerec doc's will opt for a bridge instead of an implant. In addition, Cerec is partnering with implant companies now and we arent going to hand over our sales dollars to Patterson. Furthermore, most are using CAD/CAM to mill custom abutments which are stronger than what youre doing. Major manufactures arent going to sit by and watch as your abutmet causes implant failures. If you do a little more research you find everyone has a CAD/CAM system for milling abutments which allows for far more customization. Again, youre an after thought in the lab market which is where most implant abutments are made. So professor, lets hear your numbers on IMPLANT abutments and crowns since you are in fact on an implant board. Oh, congrats on lossing $100 million (on chairside units alone) over the last 6 years.....great job!!
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Sirona and Patterson have not had a losing quarter - EVER. Patterson has had 154 years of growth and profit. Sirona since breaking away from Siemans 40 ago, has never lost money. So not sure where your numbers are coming from. In regard to your misaligned information. Cerec is used by thousands of labs. It's called the Inlab. Labs mill eMax, lava, empress and zirconia and study models with Cerec inlab. The chair side version of which there are almost 20,000, is well established. Sirona is now in the midst of launching the new software able to design and mill abutments. The abutments are full zirconia and Sirona has designed a sintering oven that fires them in 10 mins. So, yes, chair side custom abutments, milled, fired and delivered chair side in the same time as a chair side crown. Cost to dr: about $100- complete abutment, crown, tie base and impression coping. Compared to $600 for a lab processed zirconia Procera abutment. Savings:$ 500. If the implant fails like Nobel tries to scare drs into believing doctor can buy another implant AND still have $200 left over. Since thousands of doctors have been using third party abutments on top of Nobel implants for years - like Atlantis or Implant direct, it's unlikely mass failures will occur. The fit of a lot of these abutments is better than what Nobel itself offers. Less rotational movement, tighter biological width. The onslaught continues.
 




I used to be a Nobel rep. Now I sell another product and its amazing to see how many doctors are and have been using implant direct or Atlantis abutments on top of Nobel implants. When I was a Nobel rep all the doctors told me they were using a custom abutment but it turns out they weren't being honest. They were using a competitors abutments they just didn't tell me. The doctors wanted to continue getting the expertise and free service from their Nobel rep but were buying cheaper products the whole time. This is the reality of being the highest priced player with a declining market share.
 




"Patterson has had 154 years of growth and profit. Sirona since breaking away from Siemans 40 ago, has never lost money."

So much delusion, So little time...

Below Me.


You're Brainwashed and Hopeless.

Go sell crazy somewhere else, were all stocked up here.

Seek professional help.
 




Anonymous said:
"Patterson has had 154 years of growth and profit. Sirona since breaking away from Siemans 40 ago, has never lost money."

So much delusion, So little time...

Below Me.


You're Brainwashed and Hopeless.

Go sell crazy somewhere else, were all stocked up here.

Seek professional help.
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Learn to write a complete sentence. Have someone in your company look at the history of PDCO. Profitable for almost 1.5 centuries. Sure I'm completely brainwashed, but the company gave me a whole boatload of stock that has made me wealthy. Sorry, that Nobel doesn't have a stock purchase or stock grant program as part of their benefits. You're brainwashed believing Nobel is not on a huge marketshare and profit slide. Look at the facts like their annual and quarterly reports. Quarter over quarter sales declines. Either due to the poor level of sales people like you, or the onslaught of low priced competitors. Probably both.
 




I just looked at the Interim Report dated Aug. 22, 2013. Things are sure not looking good. Revenue down, profit down, Gross Margin down. This is a market that is experiencing Zero growth. So what this means is that although the market for dental implants is flat, Nobel is selling fewer, and making less money, this means Nobel's competitors are gaining marketshare, and revenue at Nobel's expense. The idiot that posted previously, should take a look at facts like these before making unsubstantiated claims, and remarks.
According to Nobel itself, both its 2012 annual report and 2013 interim report, their profits, gross margin, revenue are declining, and their expenses are increasing. This could be due to heavy discounts in order to sell their product, reductions in sales personal, strength of competitors, or lack of new products, all of these issues have plagued Nobel for at least 5 years.
 








Anonymous said:
I used to be a Nobel rep. Now I sell another product and its amazing to see how many doctors are and have been using implant direct or Atlantis abutments on top of Nobel implants. When I was a Nobel rep all the doctors told me they were using a custom abutment but it turns out they weren't being honest. They were using a competitors abutments they just didn't tell me. The doctors wanted to continue getting the expertise and free service from their Nobel rep but were buying cheaper products the whole time. This is the reality of being the highest priced player with a declining market share.
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Lyon docs? OMG!
 








Anonymous said:
I just looked at the Interim Report dated Aug. 22, 2013. Things are sure not looking good. Revenue down, profit down, Gross Margin down. This is a market that is experiencing Zero growth. So what this means is that although the market for dental implants is flat, Nobel is selling fewer, and making less money, this means Nobel's competitors are gaining marketshare, and revenue at Nobel's expense. The idiot that posted previously, should take a look at facts like these before making unsubstantiated claims, and remarks.
According to Nobel itself, both its 2012 annual report and 2013 interim report, their profits, gross margin, revenue are declining, and their expenses are increasing. This could be due to heavy discounts in order to sell their product, reductions in sales personal, strength of competitors, or lack of new products, all of these issues have plagued Nobel for at least 5 years.
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If this information is true let it be a warning to all reps in the implant business. The biggest boy on the block may not be losing fights be he ain't winning either. When you dilute a market NO ONE makes money in sales. It's hard to use your bullshit ID implants as a cost hedge and even worse positioning your Straumann implants as a premium alternative. No where to go but the unemployment office.
 




anonymous said:
If this information is true let it be a warning to all reps in the implant business. The biggest boy on the block may not be losing fights be he ain't winning either. When you dilute a market NO ONE makes money in sales. It's hard to use your bullshit ID implants as a cost hedge and even worse positioning your Straumann implants as a premium alternative. No where to go but the unemployment office.
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bullshit ID? haha...please.
 




anonymous said:
If this information is true let it be a warning to all reps in the implant business. The biggest boy on the block may not be losing fights be he ain't winning either. When you dilute a market NO ONE makes money in sales. It's hard to use your bullshit ID implants as a cost hedge and even worse positioning your Straumann implants as a premium alternative. No where to go but the unemployment office.
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64 new reps in 2016.
 








So here we find ourselves 5 years later

The facts are that 3rd party abutments ARE failing implamts and the science shows it!!
All the docs looking to save money and reps pushing their docs into off brand did the patients and their doctors a disservice.

It's all about proper fit. The FDA mandated use of OEM abutments due to the Science behind the technology

If you change the screw, abutment, or to base to an off brand that is not 100 pct identical it will cause issues!! Sometimes major patient problems.

Cerec makes a decent crown. Atlantis abutments on Nobel Implants have screw loosening issues. Cerec Tibase is a horrible idea and restorative docs should run from that solution. Use it for crown and bridge.

The studies are just starting to roll out and it's bad for third party abutments.
 




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