IGG2000

[Dr. Heilman]

Dr.Heliman- I think there is some misunderstanding regarding the amount of research that has been done on IgG supplementation (not colostrum). So much that I cannot post everything here. You will have to meet me half way and look at the research yourself. Please use these sources for said data.


#1 Effect of supplementation with multiple micronutrients (MMN) and/or bovine serum concentrate (BSC) on the growth of low-income, peri-urban Guatemalan (View Abstract)
KH Brown, MC Santizo, F Begin, B. Torun.
7/27/2004

#2 Acceptability, Safety, and Digestibility of Spray-Dried Bovine Serum Added to Diets of Recovering Malnourished Children (View Abstract)
Jorge L. Lembcke, Janet M. Peerson and Kenneth H. Brown
1/1/1997


#3 Cholesterol-lowering effect of skim milk from immunized cows in hypercholesterolemic patients (View Abstract)
Alain Golay, Jean-Marc Ferrara, Jean-Pierre Felber, and Heinz Schneider
7/20/2004


#4 Anti-inflammatory properties of human serum IgA: induction of IL-1 receptor antagonist and Fc-R(CD89)- medicated down-regulation of tumour necrosis fa (View Abstract)
H.M. wolf, I. Hauber, H. Gulle, A. Samstag, M.B Fischer, R.U. Ahmad and M.M. Eibl
7/14/2004


#5 Bovine colostrum: does it improve athletic performance? (View Abstract)
Jonathan D. Buckley
7/14/2004


#6 Evaluation of animal protein supplements in diets of early-weaned pigs (View Abstract)
J.A Hansen, J.L. Nelssen, R.D. Goodband, and T.L. Weeden
7/14/2004


#7 Plasma protein for pigs weaned at 19 to 24 days of age: effect on performance and plasma insulin-like growth factor I, growth hormone, insulin, and gl (View Abstract)
B.Z. de Rodas, K.S. Sohn, C.V. Maxwell, and L.J. Spicer
7/14/2004


#8 The Effects of Bovine Colostrum Supplementation on Body Composition and Exercise Performance in Active Men and Women (View Abstract)
Jose Antonio, Michael S. Sanders, and Darin Van Gammeren
7/14/2004


#9 Effect of bovine colostrum on anaerobic exercise performance and plasma insulin-like growth factor I (View Abstract)
Jonathan D. Buckley, Grant D. Brinkworth, and Marion J. Abbott
7/14/2004


#10 Use of spray-dried animal plasma in diets for weanling pigs (View Abstract)
Richard D. Coffey and Gary L. Cromwell
12/1/2001


#11 The Use of Bovine Serum Protein as an Oral Support Therapy Following Coronavirus Challenge in Calves (View Abstract)
J.D. Arthington, C.A. Jaynes, H.D. Tyler, S. Kaplis and J.D. Quigley, III
5/1/2002


#12 Oral Bovine Serum Concentrate Improves Cryptosporidial Enteritis in Calves (View Abstract)
Hunt, E. et al.
11/3/2002


#13 Dietary Plasma Protein Is Used More Efficiently than Extruded Soy Protein for Lean Tissue Growth in Early-Weaned Pigs (View Abstract)
Ruhong Jiang, Xiaoyan Chang, Barbara Stoll, Kenneth J. Ellis, Roman J. Shypallo, Eric Weaver, Joy Campbell and Douglas G. Burrin
3/1/2000


#14 N-Labeled Immunoglobulins from Bovine Colostrum Are Partially Resistant to Digestion in Human Intestine (View Abstract)
N. Roos, S. Mahe, R. Benamouzig, H. Sick, J. Rautureau and D. Tome
11/1/1995

I'll meet you more than half-way - I will shoot down 16 of your studies

Study #1 & #2....hmmm - adding protein to starving Guatemalan children. Okay I can't doubt that kids regarded as experiencing protein starvation may benefit from serum protein. I bet I would get the same effect with Albumin from eggs

#3 Cholesterol lowering effect - is it from having nutrient rich skim milk or from the IgG component?

#4 - IgA - NOT IgG

#5 - from protein - not IgG

#6, 7 - yes early weaned pigs use a lot of protein - not IgG from cows

#8, 9 - again - protein for athletes is important. So would albumin from eggs or lean meat


#10 - miss Piggy - again she likes Lots of protein - pigs have tremendous muscle bulk

#11, 12- - yes calves will benefit from cow colostrum and cow antibodies - calves are what cow colostrum is designed for

#13 - yes an animal based protein will have more complete amino acids which animals and humans use more than soy protein which lacks some amino acids.

#14 - hmmm cow immunoglobulins are resistant to human digestion????? doesn't this further prove my point.

For the sake of my time - I will address the other studies next week. Have a good weekend.

 

[Dr. Heilman]

Sorry I meant 14 of the studies

 

[Anonymous]

Sorry I meant 14 of the studies

Dr H, I use these studies, can you reveiw these and if you are correct I will move on, but if I am correct can you acknowledge the benefits and see me half way on your negative points, I accept your position but feel you again have half a story.

Bitzan MM, Gold BD, Philpott DJ, et al. Inhibition of Heliobacter pylori and Helicobacter mustelae binding to lipid receptors by bovine colostrum. J Infect Dis. 1998; 177:955-961.

Greenberg PD, Cello JP. Treatment of severe diarrhea caused by Crytosporidium parvum with oral bovine immunoglobulin concentrate in patients with AIDS. J Acquir Immune Defic Syndr Hum Rretrovirol. 1996; 13:348-354.

Huppertz HI, Rutkowski S, Busch DH, et al. Bovine colostrum ameliorates diarrhea in infection with diarrheagenic Escherichia coli, shiga toxin-producing E. coli, and E. coli expressing intimin and hemolysin. J Pediatr Gastroenterol Nutr. 1999; 29:452-456.

Lissner R, Thurmann PA, Merz G, Karch H. Antibody reactivity and fecal recovery of bovine immunoglobulins following oral administration of a colostrum concentrate from cows (Lactobin) to healthy volunteers. Int J Clin Pharmacol Ther. 1998; 36:239-245.

Merendino N, Prosperi S, Franci O, et al. Immunomodulatory activity of bovine colostrum on human peripheral blood mononuclear cells. J Nutr Immunol. 1996; 4:5-21.

Mero A, Miikkulainen H, Riski J, et al. Effects of bovine colostrum supplementation on serum IGF-1, IgG, hormone and saliva IgA during training. J Appl Physiol. 1997; 83: 1144-1151.

Playford RJ, Floyd DN, Macdonald CE, et al. Bovine colostrum is a health food supplement which prevents NSAID induced gut damage. Gut. 1999; 44:653-658.

Petschow BW, Talbott RD. Reduction in virus-neutralizing activity of a bovine colostrum immunoglobulin concentrate by gastric acid and digestive enzymes. J Pediatr Gastroenterol Nutr. 1994; 19:228-235.

Popik P, Bobula B, Janusz M, et al. Colostrinin, a polypeptide isolated from early milk, facilitates learning and memory in rats. Pharmacol Biochem Behav. 1999; 64:183-189.

Sarker SA, Caswall TH, Mahalanabis D, et al. Successful treatment of rotavirus diarrhea in children with immunoglobulin from immunized bovine colostrum. Pediatr Infect Dis J. 1998; 17:1149-1154.

Tacket CO, Binion SB, Bostwick E, et al. Efficacy of bovine milk immunoglobulin concentrate in preventing illness after Shigellla flexneri challenge. Am J Trop Med Hyg. 1992; 47:276-283.

Tacket CO, Losonsky G, Livio S, et al. Lack of prophylactic efficacy of an enteric-coated bovine hyperimmuune milk product against enterotoxigenic Escherichia coli challenge administered during a standard meal. J Infect Dis. 1999; 180:2056-2059.

Warny M, Fatimi A, Bostwick EF, et al. Bovine immunoglobulin concentrate-Clostridium difficile retains C. difficile toxin neutralizing activity after passage through the human stomach and small intestine. Gut. 1999; 44:212-217.

 

[Anonymous]

Oh I am sorry, I will give you 41 more studies to review; and you want my name here it is Kevin Andrews Xymogen functional medicine consultant. I am not afraid to post my name or defend the science behind Xymogen and the formulas. if you like you can email me. Unlike many on Metagenics site they like to be anonymous I have nothing to hide or be ashamed of. I encourage all my peers from Xymogen to do the same when the post as to open and honest and transparent. Xymogen hides nothing. But I will not allow you or anyone else come at us with out providing in-depth research that has been done by many of the leading Phd's, Medical Doctors, Universities, and Scientists, if this Igg did not work we would not have this discussion and we would not have a formula. We do not reinvent the wheel or create research based in a lab owned by metagenics, Do you not think that is very simular to the pharma companies who create alot of research for the sole purpose of selling a product and getting approved, but never giving you the full details on side effects, potential death or other effects, and if you look at the % of people that benefit from said drug or formula why would you take the word of the company who makes the product would you not want many outside studies, peer reviewed studies and published articles? That prove beyond a shadow of doubt it works and has benefits. That being said, Xymogen has top notch people who spend a great deal of time and resources on developing, partnering, researching, educating and providing the best formulas at a reasonable cost. I believe in Xymogen and Igg.

References for Igg and efficacy for humans: if you like more I can provide you or anyone else more studies.

1) Acosta-Altamirano, G., et al., Anti-amoebic properties of human colostrum. Adv. Exp. Med. Biol. 1987. 216B: p.1347-1352.

2) Binz, K. et al. Repopulation of The Atrophied Thymus in Diabetic Rats by

Insulin-like Grown Factor I. Proc. Natl. Acad. Sci. USA. 87(10):3690-3694. May1990.

3) Boesman-Finkelstein, M., et al., Passive oral immunization of children. Lancet. 1989. 49: p. 1336.

4) Butler, J. E. Immunoglobulins of the Mammary Secretions. Chapter Five. in:

Lactation: A Comprehensive Treatise. Vol. 3. Eds. B. L. Larson and V. R. Smith.

pp. 217-252. Academic Press. New York. 1974.

5) Christopher-Hennings, J., et al., lmmunocompromise in gnotobiotic pigs induced by verotoxin-producing Escherichia coli (Olll:NM). Infect. Immune. 1993. 61: p. 2304-2308.

6) Doyle, P. S. Anti-Cryptosporiduim antibodies inhibit infectivity in vitro and in vivo. Infection and Immunity 61(10):4079-4084. Oct. 1993.

7) Dwyer, J. M. Manipulating the Immune System with Immune Globulin. New Engl. J. Med. 326(2):107-116. Jan. 9, 1992.

8) Ebina, T., et al., Prevention of rotavirus infection by cow colostrum containing antibody against human rotavirus. Lancet. 1983.29: p. 1029-1030.

9) Ebina, T., et al., Passive immunizations of suckling mice and infants with bovine colostrum containing antibodies to human rotavirus. J. Med. Virol. 1992. 38: p. 117-123.

10) Francis, G. L., et al., Purification and partial sequence analysis of insulin-like growth factor-l (IGF-1) from bovine colostrum. Biochem. J. 1986. 233: p. 207-213.

11) Francis, G. L., et al., Insulin-like growth factors-l (IGF-1) and 2 (IGF-2) in bovine colostrum. Biochem. J. 1988. 251. 95-103.

12) Haynes, B. F. and Fauci, A. S. Introduction to Clinical Immunology. Part Two. Section 2. in: Harrison's Principles of Internal Medicine, Eleventh Edition. Eds. E. Braunwald et al. pp.328-337. McGraw Hill Book Co. New York. 1987.

13) Ho, P.C., and Lawton, J.W.M. Human colostral cells: Phagocytosis and killing of E. Coli and C. Albicans. The Journal of Pediatrics. Vol. 93, No. 6, pp. 910-915.

14) Janusz, M. et ad. Immunoregulatory Properties of Synthetic Peptides: Fragments of a Proline-rich Polypeptide from Bovine Colostrum. Molecular Immunology. 24(10): 1029-1031. 1987

15) Kim, K., et al., In vitro and in vivo neutralizing activity of human colostrum

and milk against purified toxins A and B of Clostridium difficile. T. Infect. Dis. 1985. 150: p. 57-61.

16) Lawton, J. W. M., et al., Interferon synthesis by human colostral leukocytes. Arch. Dis. Childhood. 1979. 54: p.127-130.

17) Majumdar, A. S., et al., Protective properties of anti-cholera antibodies in human colostrum. Infect. Immun. 1982. 36. 962965.

18) McClead, R., et al., Resistance of bovine anti-cholera toxin IgG to in vitro and in vivo proteolysis. Pedia. Res. 1982.6: p. 227-231.

19) Morris, J. A., et al., Passive protection of lambs against enteropathogenic Escherichia coli: Role of antibodies in serum and colostrum. T. Med. Microbiol. 1980. 13: p. 265-271.

20) Nord, J. et al. Treatment with Bovine Hyperimmune Colostrum of Cryptosporidial Diarrhea in AIDs Patients. AIDS. 4(6):581-584. June 1990.

21) Oda, S., et al., Insulin-like growth factor-l (IGF-1), growth hormone (GH), insulin and glucagon concentrations in bovine colostrum and in plasma of dairy

cows and neonatal calves around parturition. Comp. Biochem. Physiol. 1989. 94A(4): p. 805-808.

22) Ogra, P. et al. Colostrum Derived Immunity and Maternal Neonatal Interaction. Annals NY Acad. Sci. 409:82-92. 1983.

23) Palmer,E.L. et al. Antiviral Activity of Colostrum and Serum Immunoglobulins A and G. J. Med. Virol. 5:123-129. 1980.

24) Ritchie, D. J., Update on the management of intestinal cryptosporidiosis in AIDS. Ann. Pharmacother. 1994. 28: p.767-778.

25) Rump, J. A., et al., Treatment of diarrhea in human immunodeficiency virus-infected patients with immunoglobulins from bovine colostrum. Clin. lnvesti; 1992. 70: p. 588-594.

26) Sabin, A and Fieldsteel, A.H. Antipoliomyelitic activity of human and bovine colostrum and milk. Pediatrics, Jan. 1962. pp.105 - 115.

27) Sabirl, A. B., Anti-poliomyelitic substance in milk from human beings and certain cows. T. Dis. Children. 1950. 80: p.866-870.

28) Spik, G., et al., Bacteriostasis of a milk-sensitive strain of E. coli by immunoglobulins and iron-binding proteins associated with colostrum. Immunology. 1981. 35: p. 663-670.

29) Stephan, W., et al., Antibodies from colostrum in oral immunotherapy. J. Clin. Chem. Clin. Biochem. 1990. 28: p. 19-23.

30) Ungar, B. L. P., et al., Cessation of Cryptosporidium-associated diarrhea in AIDS patient after treatment with hyperimmune bovine colostrum. Gastroenterology 1990. 98: p. 486-489.

31) Wada, N., et al., Neutralizing activity against Clostridium difficile toxins in the supernatants of cultured colostral cells. Infect. Immun.. 1980.29: p. 545-550.

32) Watzl, B., et al., Enhancement of resistance to Cryptosporidium parvum by pooled bovine colostrum during murine retroviral infection. Am. T. Trop. Med. Hyg. 1993. 48(4): p. 519-523.

33) Clark, Daniel G. and Wyatt, Kaye. Colostrum, Life's First Food. Salt Lake City:CNR Publications. 1996.

34) Jensen, Bernard. Colostrum: Man's First Food, The White Gold Discovery. Escondido:Bernard Jensen, 1993.

35) Rudman, D.; et al. Effects of Human Growth Hormone in Men over 60 Years

Old. N. Eng. J. Med. 323:1-6, 1990.

36) Lange, Schreiner. Immune mechanisms of cardiac disease. New England Journal of Medicine, April 21, 1994. Vol 330 p1129(7).

37) Hakansson et al., Proceedings, Nat. Acad. of Sciences, Vol. 92, pp. 8064-8068, Aug. 1995.

38) Kohl, S. et al., Human colostral cytotoxicity: antibody-dependent cellular cytotoxicity against herpes simplex infected cells mediated by colostral cells. Journal of Clinical Laboratory Immunology, 1, pp. 221-224.

39) Dohm, Elton, et al. IgF-1 stimulated glucose transport. Diabetes, Sept. 30, 1990, pp. 1028-32.

40) Sporn, et al. Polypeptide Transforming Growth Factors (TGF A & B) and Epithelial Growth Factor isolated from bovine colostrum used for wound healing in vivo. Science, 219, pp. 1329-31, 1983.

41) Heinerman, John. Dr. Heinerman's Encyclopedia of Anti-Aging Remedies. Paramusrentice Hall, 1997; pp.85-86.

 

[Anonymous]

I'll meet you more than half-way - I will shoot down 16 of your studies

Study #1 & #2....hmmm - adding protein to starving Guatemalan children. Okay I can't doubt that kids regarded as experiencing protein starvation may benefit from serum protein. I bet I would get the same effect with Albumin from eggs

#3 Cholesterol lowering effect - is it from having nutrient rich skim milk or from the IgG component?

#4 - IgA - NOT IgG

#5 - from protein - not IgG

#6, 7 - yes early weaned pigs use a lot of protein - not IgG from cows

#8, 9 - again - protein for athletes is important. So would albumin from eggs or lean meat


#10 - miss Piggy - again she likes Lots of protein - pigs have tremendous muscle bulk

#11, 12- - yes calves will benefit from cow colostrum and cow antibodies - calves are what cow colostrum is designed for

#13 - yes an animal based protein will have more complete amino acids which animals and humans use more than soy protein which lacks some amino acids.

#14 - hmmm cow immunoglobulins are resistant to human digestion????? doesn't this further prove my point.

For the sake of my time - I will address the other studies next week. Have a good weekend.

Hi Dr. Heilman
I have had issues with IBS and IBD for a number of years, I have taken UltraInflamx, UF plus, endefen and a whole slue of other Metagenics products with no results for my condition. Only until I started to use IGG 2000 did I finally get relief, so you can spread all the rhetoric and propaganda you want about IGG 2000 not possibly being effective; but for me it has given me my life back and also the lives of many thousands of patients all over the U.S.. I suggest that if you would like to be a Metagenics rep, simply go and apply at their home office in San Clemente. I hear that they are hiring all over the country and could use someone as enthusiastic as you are about their products. Maybe you should try some patients on IGG 2000 before you go and talk poorly about such a great product.

 

[Anonymous]

I'll meet you more than half-way - I will shoot down 16 of your studies

Study #1 & #2....hmmm - adding protein to starving Guatemalan children. Okay I can't doubt that kids regarded as experiencing protein starvation may benefit from serum protein. I bet I would get the same effect with Albumin from eggs

#3 Cholesterol lowering effect - is it from having nutrient rich skim milk or from the IgG component?

#4 - IgA - NOT IgG

#5 - from protein - not IgG

#6, 7 - yes early weaned pigs use a lot of protein - not IgG from cows

#8, 9 - again - protein for athletes is important. So would albumin from eggs or lean meat


#10 - miss Piggy - again she likes Lots of protein - pigs have tremendous muscle bulk

#11, 12- - yes calves will benefit from cow colostrum and cow antibodies - calves are what cow colostrum is designed for

#13 - yes an animal based protein will have more complete amino acids which animals and humans use more than soy protein which lacks some amino acids.

#14 - hmmm cow immunoglobulins are resistant to human digestion????? doesn't this further prove my point.

For the sake of my time - I will address the other studies next week. Have a good weekend.

Please don't just read the title of the research and then comments based on that. Do you understand also that immunoglobulins are found in the Metagenics line. BioPure protein, Probioplex and Probioplex Intensive Care. IgG 2000 is not just IgG. You didn't look at the formula. It has 5000mg of Immunoglobulins (IgG, IgA, ETC) per tablespoon. The research done by Proliant and PUBLISHED was done on IgG 2000.

 

[Anonymous]

So I guess cheese, Milk, anything milk will have som Igg's, anything on this blog is for Igg 2000 and 5000 IGG'S so just read the studies they seem to make a valid point fot the benefits of Igg's from cow's. So if you do not have anything to add about this go away and buy your metagenics. i SEE WHOM EVER POSTED THIS HAS NO B@ll's to post a name.

DM

 

[Anonymous]

So I guess cheese, Milk, anything milk will have som Igg's, anything on this blog is for Igg 2000 and 5000 IGG'S so just read the studies they seem to make a valid point fot the benefits of Igg's from cow's. So if you do not have anything to add about this go away and buy your metagenics. i SEE WHOM EVER POSTED THIS HAS NO B@ll's to post a name.

DM

No is the answer to your reply. Immunoglobulins are found in very small amounts in "cheese, milk and anything milk".

 

[Anonymous]

I hope the Doctor is reading all the studies, did he get a reality check or what?. Now I do feel a little bad that he had to be given the truth on a forum like this, but the KOOL-AID drinkers need to change the beverage once in awhile. Metagenics is a good company for formulas. Xymogen is excellent at formulas, research and the people who make it all happen. I Igg200, Immunotix, Oncoplex, CoQ10, Fishoils, Fitfood, and everyhting else, we have the studies, we have the vision, we have what it takes to be number one.
And we will be.

 

[Anonymous]

I hope the Doctor is reading all the studies, did he get a reality check or what?. Now I do feel a little bad that he had to be given the truth on a forum like this, but the KOOL-AID drinkers need to change the beverage once in awhile. Metagenics is a good company for formulas. Xymogen is excellent at formulas, research and the people who make it all happen. I Igg200, Immunotix, Oncoplex, CoQ10, Fishoils, Fitfood, and everyhting else, we have the studies, we have the vision, we have what it takes to be number one.
And we will be.

It's good that you have dreams. We'll see if they ever come true. Sadly, many people at both companies will be living happily ever after at the expense of the other no matter the outcome.

 

[Anonymous]

It's good that you have dreams. We'll see if they ever come true. Sadly, many people at both companies will be living happily ever after at the expense of the other no matter the outcome.

No you are wrong! as soon as the bruised ego's over at meta heal, I believe that both companies can become allies in the industry. It is beyond bad business and poor ethics to think that one must crush the other. If and when Meta wakes up and realizes that Xymogen has a great company and great leadership along with the great formulas. Metagenics should look to us as the company who can bring both companies forward. Let me ask you a question when a doctor or practice poses a problem that lets say Metagenics does not have a viable solution Do you just make up something and move on, Do you offer another formula from a competitor, Or do you lie and sell them something that has no value for said problem? I will tell you as fact as a Xymogen rep I offer the best solution even if it is not our formula, and you know what The Doctor really looks at me like I am a partner not a salesperson. So what do you do meta?

 

[Anonymous]

I was thinking of starting a new thread. But I do not know what to call it?

The demming principle?
Let the people that built meta go, because we sucked all we could out of them and their families? or just the fact that Xymogen is here and making sure we do not make the same mistakes metagenics has made.

I too would let the doctor know of another formula it we do not have it in the line. Metagenics has great quality the problem is that the products are practically extinct. It is very sad that they just can get things together over there.

Good luck Scott, Richard, Tom, Jamie and the others that will be leaving!

 

[Dr. Heilman]

Metagenics has great quality the problem is that the products are practically extinct. It is very sad that they just can get things together over there. QUOTE]

Off-topic from this thread, but
Why would you make a statement that Metagenics products are "practically extinct"? Metagenics consistently introduces new formulas to the market on a regular basis and as you stated yourself - their quality is great. Maybe with Standard Process which has not changed many of their products for decades you could make that claim, but why would you make this statement against Metagenics?

Frankly, I can go through the Xymogen catalogue and observe numerous "X" products that are quite similar to Metagenics formulas (even the names are laughingly similar). I realize that immitation is the sincerest form of flattery, however.... when you copy a formula and put on a similar name - it sounds like a phony knock-off. Not to mention my "X" rep basically introduced many of the products as a Xymogens alternative to the Metagenics formula.


For the poster who provided me all of those studies - I have not had a chance to dive into those studies (I'll use the 4 day week as an excuse) At least these studies appear to have a more appropriate study base. Those studies posted earlier were a joke - hardly even relevant- but they sounded nice.

Also for the poster (it's hard to keep all of you Anonymous individuals distinguished from each other) who found relief from IgG when you did not get relief from the Ultra-Flora products; I'm glad you found something to relieve your symptomatology. You're actually the first person that I have heard that did NOT get relief from the Ultra-Flora product line- I've had great results with everyone I put it on - of course I recommend a strategy to use with it, maybe that makes it more effective??? Just because you didn't get relief from the product - doesn't make the product useless!!!

 

[Anonymous]

Metagenics has great quality the problem is that the products are practically extinct. It is very sad that they just can get things together over there. QUOTE]
Off-topic from this thread, but
Why would you make a statement that Metagenics products are "practically extinct"? Metagenics consistently introduces new formulas to the market on a regular basis and as you stated yourself

come on now Doc be honest, how many different ways can you take hops extract and spin it, if you call that new, wow I am speechless. And can you honestly give me or anyone, one new groundbreaking formula from metagenics in the past two-three years. new and improved or a name change does not count, LactoFlamw hardly new, or even adding a product like RIAA and calling it TIAA or whatever they call kaprex now creating some new buzz word like SKRM, please do not be so eager to post without having bullets in the gun, you shot a blank on that last post.

 

[Anonymous]

Metagenics has great quality the problem is that the products are practically extinct. It is very sad that they just can get things together over there. QUOTE]

Off-topic from this thread, but
Why would you make a statement that Metagenics products are "practically extinct"? Metagenics consistently introduces new formulas to the market on a regular basis and as you stated yourself - their quality is great. Maybe with Standard Process which has not changed many of their products for decades you could make that claim, but why would you make this statement against Metagenics?

Frankly, I can go through the Xymogen catalogue and observe numerous "X" products that are quite similar to Metagenics formulas (even the names are laughingly similar). I realize that immitation is the sincerest form of flattery, however.... when you copy a formula and put on a similar name - it sounds like a phony knock-off. Not to mention my "X" rep basically introduced many of the products as a Xymogens alternative to the Metagenics formula.


For the poster who provided me all of those studies - I have not had a chance to dive into those studies (I'll use the 4 day week as an excuse) At least these studies appear to have a more appropriate study base. Those studies posted earlier were a joke - hardly even relevant- but they sounded nice.

Also for the poster (it's hard to keep all of you Anonymous individuals distinguished from each other) who found relief from IgG when you did not get relief from the Ultra-Flora products; I'm glad you found something to relieve your symptomatology. You're actually the first person that I have heard that did NOT get relief from the Ultra-Flora product line- I've had great results with everyone I put it on - of course I recommend a strategy to use with it, maybe that makes it more effective??? Just because you didn't get relief from the product - doesn't make the product useless!!!

As respectful as I can say this . . . . What product had meta come out with that is a "head to head" in the professional market place? Take for instance, Melatonin. Most every other company has this fast acting product, but meta. Xymogen sells it for a very good price and is the least expensive in the professional market. We also have Methyl B12, Active B's, and Phosphatitalcholine. All these products are sold by many professional companies which means competition brings the price down.

Meta can not come up with "head to head" products because you will find out if they did come out with them it would be three times the price. Their excuse would be research, triple certified BS, and their heavy markups.

How many ways can you use HOPS? It seems hops solves all of our problems? No. They made up the research (not peer reviewed) to sell a product line that costs pennies. SKRMs? Many herbs are SKRMs. They make it sound like they invented this concept and charge you for it.

Doctor, the lies that they have made over the years are catching up with them. Why are so many of their senior managers leaving? And many more people soon. There must be a reason, they can not all be bad people.

Please do not get me wrong. Metagenics has taught all of us a lesson. If they did not make their mistakes over the past years we at Xymogen would not exist. I know this was a little off the subject, but it needed to be said.

 

[Anonymous]

What product had meta come out with that is a "head to head" in the professional market place? Take for instance, Melatonin. Most every other company has this fast acting product, but meta. Xymogen sells it for a very good price and is the least expensive in the professional market. We also have Methyl B12, Active B's, and Phosphatitalcholine. All these products are sold by many professional companies which means competition brings the price down.

Melatonin I have recommended to many MANY patients and I can't recall any of them noticing that the product has given them any increased ability to sleep (about as fast acting as a fossil). Maybe the quality of the one they purchased was CRAP, however just because everyone else makes it - does not mean Metagenics must also. Typically if I have a patient that needs to sleep - I put them on Myocalm PM, and I would say that at least 60% of them have improved sleep, Metagenics also has Serenegen (which I have not recommended to any of my patients). Metagenics makes a lot of formulas that the market place does NOT have anything to go (head to head) with....

I will point out that B vitamins are consistently associated with energy levels and those 8 cans of Active Essentials (contains X "active B's") that I sold - not one of the patients noticed any improvement of energy levels, whereas almost everyone of the patients on Metagenics Wellness Essentials notices increased energy levels within 4 days. So how active are those B-vitamins anyways? The 5-formyl tetrahydrofolate studies that I have read have identical absorbency to regular folic acid.

For my practice - I recommend ALL of my patients to at least do the Wellness Essentials as a minimum, and then customize other products for their individual needs. Since they feel the difference - the other products sell themselves. IF I encourage them to use the X alternative Active Essentials and they notice NO change - the other recommendations gain suspicion.

I LIKED what Xymogen had to say about their formula (cost, vege-caps, active B's Blah blah blah - I didn't like the "feedback from patients that were accustomed to how good they felt on the other product and then they didn't feel it with X).

 

[grateful grace]

Melatonin I have recommended to many MANY patients and I can't recall any of them noticing that the product has given them any increased ability to sleep (about as fast acting as a fossil). Maybe the quality of the one they purchased was CRAP, however just because everyone else makes it - does not mean Metagenics must also. Typically if I have a patient that needs to sleep - I put them on Myocalm PM, and I would say that at least 60% of them have improved sleep, Metagenics also has Serenegen (which I have not recommended to any of my patients). Metagenics makes a lot of formulas that the market place does NOT have anything to go (head to head) with....

I will point out that B vitamins are consistently associated with energy levels and those 8 cans of Active Essentials (contains X "active B's") that I sold - not one of the patients noticed any improvement of energy levels, whereas almost everyone of the patients on Metagenics Wellness Essentials notices increased energy levels within 4 days. So how active are those B-vitamins anyways? The 5-formyl tetrahydrofolate studies that I have read have identical absorbency to regular folic acid.

For my practice - I recommend ALL of my patients to at least do the Wellness Essentials as a minimum, and then customize other products for their individual needs. Since they feel the difference - the other products sell themselves. IF I encourage them to use the X alternative Active Essentials and they notice NO change - the other recommendations gain suspicion.

I LIKED what Xymogen had to say about their formula (cost, vege-caps, active B's Blah blah blah - I didn't like the "feedback from patients that were accustomed to how good they felt on the other product and then they didn't feel it with X).

I am not a doctor, nor do I work for either Xymogen or Metagenics. I have friends that work for both companies, and I have been a patient of 4 different doctors that recommend both product lines, and I have taken both lines for the past 4 years. You will have to forgive my lack of technical knowledge and know that I am speaking as a patient only. I suffer from asthma, allergies, hypothryoidism, shot adrenals, unexplained infertility and celiacs disease. I was on every product under the sun from Metagenics for 3 years and nothing worked. Everytime I took one of their horse pills I gagged. My energy remained low, their fish oils left a bad taste in my mouth, and my asthma and allergies were never relieved. Then the doctor I was seeing was introduced to Xymogen and we decided to try it out. Almost instantly, I was better. The protocol I used healed my gut and I finally have my life back! So, no disrespect, Dr. H, but just because the patients that took "those 8 cans of Active Essentials" didn't get relief or notice improvement, doesn't mean that there aren't patients out there who are forever grateful to the Xymogen line! So, kudos to Xymogen and their great products and their great formulas. Don't let the naysayers get you down!!!!

 

[Anonymous]

I am not a doctor, nor do I work for either Xymogen or Metagenics. I have friends that work for both companies, and I have been a patient of 4 different doctors that recommend both product lines, and I have taken both lines for the past 4 years. You will have to forgive my lack of technical knowledge and know that I am speaking as a patient only. I suffer from asthma, allergies, hypothryoidism, shot adrenals, unexplained infertility and celiacs disease. I was on every product under the sun from Metagenics for 3 years and nothing worked. Everytime I took one of their horse pills I gagged. My energy remained low, their fish oils left a bad taste in my mouth, and my asthma and allergies were never relieved. Then the doctor I was seeing was introduced to Xymogen and we decided to try it out. Almost instantly, I was better. The protocol I used healed my gut and I finally have my life back! So, no disrespect, Dr. H, but just because the patients that took "those 8 cans of Active Essentials" didn't get relief or notice improvement, doesn't mean that there aren't patients out there who are forever grateful to the Xymogen line! So, kudos to Xymogen and their great products and their great formulas. Don't let the naysayers get you down!!!!

Sounds like you are getting the medical attention you need to relieve all your ailments. This may be a good time to seek out a priest or someone else who can help you with all the lying.

 

[Anonymous]

Spoke to my preist he said your a jackass then he offered me a BJ.

 

[Anonymous]

Sounds like you are getting the medical attention you need to relieve all your ailments. This may be a good time to seek out a priest or someone else who can help you with all the lying.

I love Zac Efron and my color is red.