Finally my two cents about the future of this company

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Anonymous

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The prime example of how Forest has gradually lost all respect internally and within the entire industry is simple. As many people have posted earlier...none of our current leaders possess the crucial experience, professional maturity, or any type of motivation or leadership skills. Just ask the reps who work for the abundant 24-25 year old "DM" (if you can seriously call them that), barely out of college, no clue what to do. Forest was a powerhouse 5+ years ago when the leaders were accomplished, had a true pattern of accomplished success, maybe even a President's Club win or two?, and were truly ready and willing to lead a team of professionals. Promotions have become - "Who can I promote that will be easy for me to manipulate and drink the company kool aid." It is very sad to see so many great people leave the company or lose total motivation because of poor leadership and a severe turn to micromanagement. If forest regroups and looks at what made them successful in the past ( i.e., positive feedback, leaders who can demonstrate and teach advanced selling techniques, and a little more flexibility just to name a few)...Forest may have a chance. Don't get me wrong - I'm all about accountability and results just as everyone should be who is in sales...but when you have a leadership team that ONLY focuses on those outcomes by micromanaging ( KPI, time stamps, sample %) -How can your reps possibly achieve sales goals without positive motivating, ( not by fear), BENEFICIAL teaching and coaching, or respecting their reps...you get what you have today -- A TOTALLY BURNT and DEMOTIVATED SALES FORCE. I cringe evertime, which is everday - when I hear that reps are scrampling around for signatures and speeding in their 4 cylinder Fusions at the end of the month to make sure they hit their 80% of A targets or they dread the possibility of an LOC. I mean c'mon. We all know this has become standard field procedure today...unless you are of course with your managers. No selling involved. Or should I say no REAL selling involved,

Corporate can talk all they want about industry changes and how we need to adapt...sure I do believe that times are changing in Parma. But what fundamentally NEEDS to stay the same are mature, experienced, proven track winner salesmen and women, who have fought and clawed to get to a leadership position that they have dreamed of becoming since day one. Those leaders are gone...we are now "transgressing" into children leading potential leaders.

The result is a non respected relationship between the DM and the rep, and a relationship fostererd by fear rather that encouagement. This model will kill Forest and it has to change rapidly. Hire good people, promote deserved and experienced leaders, keep successful tenured reps motivated....and get back to what made Forest it and industry leader. It' not rocket science!

I am no longer with this company ( very, very, happily gone) but still give kudos to the way things used to be at Forest and hope for my friends still there that something changes and you can experience what Pharm sales was, should and hopefully can be again...

Good luck everyone
 






So true and well said. My area has now become so micro-managed I have a DM that's been with the company for less time than I have, who sits back and looks at reports and tells me which doctors I need to focus on. She has no idea of a doctors' access, objections (like indications!), relationships, etc. What happened to the days when we could actually "run our territory like it was our own business" and we could pick the doctors we thought would grow business for us? This job/company has become such a joke. No more selling, just all smoke and mirrors to keep these naive and ignorant managers off our backs.
 






what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this forum is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
 


















I could not agree more with the original post. I too have recently left Forest and had been with them for close to 10 years. I use to love Forest and the originality and common sense of mgmt. I left for all of the above listed reasons and haven't regretted my decison for one day. I could no longer digest all of the insane micromanagement and had no respect left for mgmt. It is not the company I so proudly worked for years ago. I could have easily have kept earning 100,000+ and kept my mouth shut but, at the end of the day I had no respect for what I was doing and the paycheck seemed meaningless. At least once a week I talked to someone at Forest who complains about all the nonsense and I just thank God that I had the ability to change my future. The markets only as poor as you make it out too be.
 












Anonymous said:
I could not agree more with the original post. I too have recently left Forest and had been with them for close to 10 years. I use to love Forest and the originality and common sense of mgmt. I left for all of the above listed reasons and haven't regretted my decison for one day. I could no longer digest all of the insane micromanagement and had no respect left for mgmt. It is not the company I so proudly worked for years ago. I could have easily have kept earning 100,000+ and kept my mouth shut but, at the end of the day I had no respect for what I was doing and the paycheck seemed meaningless. At least once a week I talked to someone at Forest who complains about all the nonsense and I just thank God that I had the ability to change my future. The markets only as poor as you make it out too be.
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where were you? Southeast? N FL?
 






Most people are not happy with just "easy". And I think it's sad that you are. Onto to better things. And now I expect some super smart retort to which I will not dignify with a response.
 






You're right...I did give up the easiest 100K job ever. I am now making double that in device sales, motivated and challenged everyday, and not treated like a kindergartener. It amazing to wake up in the morning excited to go to work again.
 






Anonymous said:
You're right...I did give up the easiest 100K job ever. I am now making double that in device sales, motivated and challenged everyday, and not treated like a kindergartener. It amazing to wake up in the morning excited to go to work again.
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Sorry, I call BS on your post. You can't even put together a coherent sentence. “It amazing….” No way could someone with that poor of grammar skills be in medical device sales.
 






Post #1 and #2 are right on the money. Post #3 is a fucking r*****!

This company is going down hill for 1 reason and 1 reason only - they continue to promote 25-30 year old inmature inexperienced children that don't have a clue on how to lead, motivate or run a business.
 






And your pissed off because those are the people who are being promoted past you? As you sit and sulk they are taking advantage of a opportunity. If it does not work out, they go back as a rep with a nice base salary or go somewhere else. While you are stuck as a rep who people just dont understand and you piss and moan at team meetings about how young and dumb your manager is. Funny thing is, you are the one who lost!
 






All u idiots are full of shit. FRX happens to be the best investment I've seen in about 5 yrs. I would stay as long as I could especially if u have options -they will be worth alot more in the next 24 months.
 






Anonymous said:
what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this forum is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
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Nice line. I liked it the first time when I heard it on Billy Madison. Try coming up with your own comments jack***
 






Firstly, there is rampant ageism on this website. I'm a 20-something rep and could absolutely take over a DM role right now. Just because you are a certain age, does not make you unqualified. I agree that you need sales experience to have a DM job but you could have 6 or 7 years of experience by the time you are 29...that is not enough?

Secondly, President's Club sales reps do not make President's Club DMs. What this and other industries continue to fail to realize is that by solely promoting people with good (or great) sales numbers, you are missing out on the most crucial aspect of being a manager - leadership. Its not the age or the sales experience that's missing - its this #1 quality leadership that many of the Forest DMs lack.

If Forest gave more incentive to Presidents Club reps to continue on as reps and promoted true leaders (not just sales performers), we would be in a lot better situation.
 






Sorry kid. Too many have tried your idea and that is why were are in the situation we are in. I have hired reps who finally earn their MBA's and tell me they want to be promoted. My reply is you go through the same developmental channels as everyone else WHILE performing above expectations. With the MBA should be able to do it BETTER.

I refuse to support some self proclaimed whiz kid so that he will be promoted and spend his time ruining the lives of good reps. If you feel you have the talent then consistently demonstrate it. My guess is you are learning but still have many miles to go.

Good luck stick with it.
 






Anonymous said:
Firstly, there is rampant ageism on this website. I'm a 20-something rep and could absolutely take over a DM role right now. Just because you are a certain age, does not make you unqualified. I agree that you need sales experience to have a DM job but you could have 6 or 7 years of experience by the time you are 29...that is not enough?

Secondly, President's Club sales reps do not make President's Club DMs. What this and other industries continue to fail to realize is that by solely promoting people with good (or great) sales numbers, you are missing out on the most crucial aspect of being a manager - leadership. Its not the age or the sales experience that's missing - its this #1 quality leadership that many of the Forest DMs lack.

If Forest gave more incentive to Presidents Club reps to continue on as reps and promoted true leaders (not just sales performers), we would be in a lot better situation.
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I don't think anyone on here is complaining about just the age of DMs. It's the fact that many of the DMs are being promoted without personal sales experience (i.e. only 2 years as a rep straight out of college), and without emotional intelligence and coaching abilities (what truly makes for a good manager). Instead we have a bunch of idiots running the company doing whatever they are told to do by the higher-ups because they have no way of developing their own leadership strategies. If a DM sucks, it doesn't matter whether they are 25 or 55.
 






i like when people say "you gave up the easiest 100k job". Hey slouch, what if some of us have aspirations beyond 100k? 100k, unless you live in the middle of nowhere, sucks. If you're within 200 miles of either coast (north and south), 100k sucks.
So, while i agree the job is easy, 100k is not everyone's bar for good money. perhaps if this was 12 years ago, i'd agree. of course we're lucky to have jobs. goes without saying.
Take the experience and try to actually make a living. As for the stock options and their value, the stock is down about 25% over the last 5 yrs. Good luck. They've been selling that bag of crap for a while. That and the stupid points.
Money matters.
 






Anonymous said:
I don't think anyone on here is complaining about just the age of DMs. It's the fact that many of the DMs are being promoted without personal sales experience (i.e. only 2 years as a rep straight out of college), and without emotional intelligence and coaching abilities (what truly makes for a good manager). Instead we have a bunch of idiots running the company doing whatever they are told to do by the higher-ups because they have no way of developing their own leadership strategies. If a DM sucks, it doesn't matter whether they are 25 or 55.
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This is exactly right - good and accurate post. Age is not the issue; it is all about experience. Unfortunately, it normally coincides with age so young people get trashed but if you're in your late 20's or early 30's and have 8-10 years in the field, you could be an excellent manager.
 






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