Endoscopy Reps

[anonymous]

Couldn't agree more. The level of arrogance these assholes have when walking into lab is ridiculous. They walk in like they own the place. Btw, How is BT working out for y'all? Paid $234M for a technology with NO reimbursement. BSC reps don't know how to sell capital either...they give it away or bundle it for disposable usage. Clowns.

EndoChoice is the new BT. Why did you buy that again? cleaning brushes, bite blocks, snares... Paid how much for that bag of s?!
And the new EUS needle totally blows. Back in the day they used to launch stuff that worked and would change the market.

 

[anonymous]

Couldn't agree more. The level of arrogance these assholes have when walking into lab is ridiculous. They walk in like they own the place. Btw, How is BT working out for y'all? Paid $234M for a technology with NO reimbursement. BSC reps don't know how to sell capital either...they give it away or bundle it for disposable usage. Clowns.

Boston didn't buy Endochoice for Fuse, they bough it for the pathology and SUP products. It actually is a smart move. Boston really has not done much for creating new products so this is their avenue for growth. Make fun of it all you want, but Endochoice did something like $70 million in pathology and SUP last year. Sure that's chump change compared to Boston GI, but they had like 70 reps compared to what? Several hundred at Boston. Additionally Endochoice was a young company and what they accomplished with just SUP and Pathology in such a short period of time shouldn't be laughed at but applauded. Here is where I give respect to the reps of EC and you should too; Endochoice didn't have strong gpo contracts like Boston does. Boston reps havent had to sell in years instead they just strong arm and put fear into their accounts to be "compliant" to meet the discount. Endochoice reps had develop relationships and actually sell their product. Hell, that company created a market for "endokits" which numerous other competitors have recognized income potential and are going after.

Sure, their forceps weren't much of anything amazing, probably equal to Bostons. But their needle, retrieval net and forceps and snare are a damn good product.

So again, Boston didnt buy endochoice for Fuse they bought it for the disposable and pathology piece.

BTW: I'm the same person you quoted and responded to so continuing along the same conversation.

 

[anonymous]

Boston didn't buy Endochoice for Fuse, they bough it for the pathology and SUP products. It actually is a smart move. Boston really has not done much for creating new products so this is their avenue for growth. Make fun of it all you want, but Endochoice did something like $70 million in pathology and SUP last year. Sure that's chump change compared to Boston GI, but they had like 70 reps compared to what? Several hundred at Boston. Additionally Endochoice was a young company and what they accomplished with just SUP and Pathology in such a short period of time shouldn't be laughed at but applauded. Here is where I give respect to the reps of EC and you should too; Endochoice didn't have strong gpo contracts like Boston does. Boston reps havent had to sell in years instead they just strong arm and put fear into their accounts to be "compliant" to meet the discount. Endochoice reps had develop relationships and actually sell their product. Hell, that company created a market for "endokits" which numerous other competitors have recognized income potential and are going after.

Sure, their forceps weren't much of anything amazing, probably equal to Bostons. But their needle, retrieval net and forceps and snare are a damn good product.

So again, Boston didnt buy endochoice for Fuse they bought it for the disposable and pathology piece.

BTW: I'm the same person you quoted and responded to so continuing along the same conversation.

Note: Same person you are/were responding to.

My original post was not meant to make fun of EC at all. I agree with everything you said. My original intent was to come down on the BSC reps for the lack of selling. From what Ive heard in different GI labs within my territory, the current BSC reps aren't taking that piece of business very seriously. Either they don't care or don't want to understand the revenue potential of the kits. There aren't many products (if any) in the current BSC bag that are used in EVERY case...the kits are. Some of the reps are too arrogant and refuse to put in the proper reprocessing training to be successful with this new product line they are picking up. As you mentioned, there are a lot of companies out there that will gladly jump in and go after it.

As far as Fuse goes, I get it. They are not equipped to sell Fuse and quite frankly, I don't think they could do it.

 

[anonymous]

Note: Same person you are/were responding to.

My original post was not meant to make fun of EC at all. I agree with everything you said. My original intent was to come down on the BSC reps for the lack of selling. From what Ive heard in different GI labs within my territory, the current BSC reps aren't taking that piece of business very seriously. Either they don't care or don't want to understand the revenue potential of the kits. There aren't many products (if any) in the current BSC bag that are used in EVERY case...the kits are. Some of the reps are too arrogant and refuse to put in the proper reprocessing training to be successful with this new product line they are picking up. As you mentioned, there are a lot of companies out there that will gladly jump in and go after it.

As far as Fuse goes, I get it. They are not equipped to sell Fuse and quite frankly, I don't think they could do it.

Continuing conversation:

Agreed with everything you said. Tomorrow Boston will announce that they are killing fuse as they couldn't sell it off, it's a real shame.

Boston better hope their reps can actually sell or that 300 million investment is going to take a damn long time to see ROI. I do love seeing the arrogance of Boston. I think this will prove to be more challenging than they thought. I wouldn't be surprised to see EC reps getting a phone call in 8-12 months from Boston asking to work for them.

 

[anonymous]

Continuing conversation:

Agreed with everything you said. Tomorrow Boston will announce that they are killing fuse as they couldn't sell it off, it's a real shame.

Boston better hope their reps can actually sell or that 300 million investment is going to take a damn long time to see ROI. I do love seeing the arrogance of Boston. I think this will prove to be more challenging than they thought. I wouldn't be surprised to see EC reps getting a phone call in 8-12 months from Boston asking to work for them.

Continuing:

Have you heard something about an actual announcement? Is there any truth to this? I hope it's false. Yes, Fuse had more growing pains than the usual products, but they finally got it right. It's a damn shame.

The EC reps (not all of them) that were passed up are honestly better off without BSC. As you mentioned in your earlier post, it was a hard job to go in and grow the business they did in a space dominated by BSC and very few GPOs to fall back on. They didn't go in and promote fear, they did it the right way. They formed relationships and gave the labs the freedom to make the right decisions based on patients...not price and contract compliance. Path and SUPs aren't big enough for the ROI BSC will be expecting (see BT).

 

[anonymous]

Continuing

Call was canceled but I have confirmation from both several people high up at BSC and several people at EC on the Fuse side (who are also being retained) is that yes, Boston is killing it and will more than likely offer to buy back the systems for what the customer paid for it. Honestly, I hope those who leased it tell them to get fucked then turn it back in after the 3-5 year lease is up. Those who paid cash should definitely jump on it though if BSC offers that.

BSC is going to struggle in the surgery center. Surgery centers do not give a shit about your GPO position or whatever strong arm tactic BSC tries to throw at them. I also see several lawsuits coming down on BSC at some point as some of the jackass reps will try to leverage single use products with pathology, which illegal and the government will come crushing down on them. If BSC could remove their head from their ass and train reps to actually sell instead of "contract compliance," they could see huge ROI on the single use product and pathology. Pathology is such a high margin / high revenue driver that they could probably leverage just that and make a good ROI. However, I don't see them being successful at it.

The arrogance works in the hospital as all they have to do is fluff the physicians ego, keep certain physicians as KOLS aka paid off physicians, and leverage the contract at the purchasing level. This tactic doesn't fare so well in the surgery center and given Olympus just got fined 680 million for buying off physicians, I wouldn't be surprised to see BSC in the news within a few years.

Continuing:

Have you heard something about an actual announcement? Is there any truth to this? I hope it's false. Yes, Fuse had more growing pains than the usual products, but they finally got it right. It's a damn shame.

The EC reps (not all of them) that were passed up are honestly better off without BSC. As you mentioned in your earlier post, it was a hard job to go in and grow the business they did in a space dominated by BSC and very few GPOs to fall back on. They didn't go in and promote fear, they did it the right way. They formed relationships and gave the labs the freedom to make the right decisions based on patients...not price and contract compliance. Path and SUPs aren't big enough for the ROI BSC will be expecting (see BT).

 

[anonymous]

Continuing

Call was canceled but I have confirmation from both several people high up at BSC and several people at EC on the Fuse side (who are also being retained) is that yes, Boston is killing it and will more than likely offer to buy back the systems for what the customer paid for it. Honestly, I hope those who leased it tell them to get fucked then turn it back in after the 3-5 year lease is up. Those who paid cash should definitely jump on it though if BSC offers that.

BSC is going to struggle in the surgery center. Surgery centers do not give a shit about your GPO position or whatever strong arm tactic BSC tries to throw at them. I also see several lawsuits coming down on BSC at some point as some of the jackass reps will try to leverage single use products with pathology, which illegal and the government will come crushing down on them. If BSC could remove their head from their ass and train reps to actually sell instead of "contract compliance," they could see huge ROI on the single use product and pathology. Pathology is such a high margin / high revenue driver that they could probably leverage just that and make a good ROI. However, I don't see them being successful at it.

The arrogance works in the hospital as all they have to do is fluff the physicians ego, keep certain physicians as KOLS aka paid off physicians, and leverage the contract at the purchasing level. This tactic doesn't fare so well in the surgery center and given Olympus just got fined 680 million for buying off physicians, I wouldn't be surprised to see BSC in the news within a few years.

Continuing

You hit the nail on the head with the bundling of path and devices. As far as surgery centers go, I know of four that are taking their kit business elsewhere. They don't want to deal with the headache of being told they need to use more based on contract compliance. I do, however, find it ridiculously funny that CS and PC have been put in management positions to run the ASC business. What has CS done (other than kiss ass) to warrant this position?

 

[anonymous]

Seaman won't last. His story on how he closed his ONLY Fuse account is complete crap and the fact that GC bought it as truth is hilarious. No input on PC on how he landed the gig but he seems to fit the Boston mold and that's really more important than results. But I also can't speak for his results as I was never really close to him or the team.

It will be interesting to follow the success or failure over the next year. I suspect success in the hospital but failure in the ASC.

I'm just glad I got out before the shit show went down. It did sound like Boston took care of the EC reps financially and offered a severance, according to a few reps I spoke with.

Continuing

You hit the nail on the head with the bundling of path and devices. As far as surgery centers go, I know of four that are taking their kit business elsewhere. They don't want to deal with the headache of being told they need to use more based on contract compliance. I do, however, find it ridiculously funny that CS and PC have been put in management positions to run the ASC business. What has CS done (other than kiss ass) to warrant this position?

 

[anonymous]

Seaman won't last. His story on how he closed his ONLY Fuse account is complete crap and the fact that GC bought it as truth is hilarious. No input on PC on how he landed the gig but he seems to fit the Boston mold and that's really more important than results. But I also can't speak for his results as I was never really close to him or the team.

It will be interesting to follow the success or failure over the next year. I suspect success in the hospital but failure in the ASC.

I'm just glad I got out before the shit show went down. It did sound like Boston took care of the EC reps financially and offered a severance, according to a few reps I spoke with.

I also want to add that Seaman never sold Path either and now he is in a position that requires him to lead the charge into selling path in ASCs. Makes complete sense.

I chose to ride the shitshow out knowing Boston was doing right by the reps that chose to stay. From a financial standpoint, it wasn't a tough decision.

 

[anonymous]

I also want to add that Seaman never sold Path either and now he is in a position that requires him to lead the charge into selling path in ASCs. Makes complete sense.

I chose to ride the shitshow out knowing Boston was doing right by the reps that chose to stay. From a financial standpoint, it wasn't a tough decision.

You're correct. CS couldn't sell pathology at EC and now he's leading the charge. This should be fun to watch. That guy must've sold a lot of snake oil during the interview with Boston.

 

[anonymous]

You're correct. CS couldn't sell pathology at EC and now he's leading the charge. This should be fun to watch. That guy must've sold a lot of snake oil during the interview with Boston.

You call it snake oil and I call it the delivery of HJs to everyone involved in process. Yes, it will be fun to watch the inept approach when dealing with these accounts that are at risk as of today.