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Embarrassed to be in pharma

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Anonymous said:
Tell ya what, Mr. Drug Consumer - next time you go to the doc and he/she wants to give you FREE, yes fucking FREE goddamed samples, simply say no thank you.
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With your foul mouth you would fit right in with the sleazy Cialis marketing morons at Eli Lilly who spew "4 hour erections" 24/7 on our "family" TV networks!!!
 




Anonymous said:
I do not admit to strangers that I am employeed by a drug company. Why? National and local news media have criticized drug ads which border on the unethical (if not illegal) several times lately. That is troubling enough in itself but most friends are more than fed up and disgusted by the 24/7 cheesy/sleezy "ED" ads blasting from TV with their "4 hour erection" warnings, esp parents who cannot watch TV without explaining what the above means. Many say they never watch TV with guests now.

When I began work in this field, it was an admired profession by health care professionals as well as the general public. After the sales and marketing hucksters took over from ethical management , the industry has gone down the tubes. Oh, the hiring of ex cheerleaders , car rental folks,etc, who can barely spell pharmaceutical, to promote the product has not helped the image either. Just last week a leading national talk show host was making jokes about the pharma cheerleaders.

I never thought when I was hired that I would ever be placed in the huckster category. Really sad.
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Has pharma cleaned up its act or has all the embarrassment from the medical community of hiring unqualified (ex car salespeople,etc) by unqualified management still in effect?
 








Anonymous said:
Has pharma cleaned up its act or has all the embarrassment from the medical community of hiring unqualified (ex car salespeople,etc) by unqualified management still in effect?
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For your information, I know of a few ex car salespeople who sold Jags and Mercedes that made a lot more than pharma people.
 




Your embarrassed? Then quit! If providing prescription medication to offices is below your level of acceptance then leave. This industry has been unfairly attacked for years. Most physicians still like reps and some great relationships are made. Some do not. That is true in any industry. I can remember selling blood pressure medication that had so many side effects that people would go ahead and quit taking the pills rather than suffer the side effects. Now there are ARBS, ACE's, CCB's and other classifications that have minimal side effects. All of these were researched and produced by private industry. The same thing with H2 inhibitors and some later antibiotics. People are better taken care of today because of the new breakthroughs in pharmaceuticals. If you want to apologize for bringing that information to the medical community then quit and work in a bank, or a department store (that would be far more fulfilling).

You are a sick puppy for being ashamed to tell the public that you work for a pharmaceutical company. If you are go do something else--anything, but get out. This is a honorable business if you choose to make it honorable. You will see physicians that not everybody sees if you bring something of value to them. If you are going to slide around and be a sample delivery rep, then you won't enjoy the job.
 




Anonymous said:
Your embarrassed? Then quit! If providing prescription medication to offices is below your level of acceptance then leave. This industry has been unfairly attacked for years. Most physicians still like reps and some great relationships are made. Some do not. That is true in any industry. I can remember selling blood pressure medication that had so many side effects that people would go ahead and quit taking the pills rather than suffer the side effects. Now there are ARBS, ACE's, CCB's and other classifications that have minimal side effects. All of these were researched and produced by private industry. The same thing with H2 inhibitors and some later antibiotics. People are better taken care of today because of the new breakthroughs in pharmaceuticals. If you want to apologize for bringing that information to the medical community then quit and work in a bank, or a department store (that would be far more fulfilling).

You are a sick puppy for being ashamed to tell the public that you work for a pharmaceutical company. If you are go do something else--anything, but get out. This is a honorable business if you choose to make it honorable. You will see physicians that not everybody sees if you bring something of value to them. If you are going to slide around and be a sample delivery rep, then you won't enjoy the job.
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I too felt embarrassed to be in pharma and while it took my a year to get out (prior to the market crash) I finally did. I remember almost every day starting my car and putting my head on the steering wheel and sighing for a good 15 seconds. The bottomline is that if you want to make a difference for your own personal good and the community, being a drug rep probably isn't the job for you. When I talk to people about being a drug rep they talk about the perks they get as reps. Maybe the drug industry should rethink their hires.

On the device side I am not saying it is any better. Because device reps are paid significantly more than most sales fields all you tend to hear us talk about is money, etc.

People are people. My Doctors I sell to aren't saints either. With my device they want to know how much it costs and how much can bill medicare for it's use. Then you see them doing the math in their head, smile and sign.

Self perservation i guess.
 




I agree that the pharmaceutical industry may not be for everyone. You had the guts to do something about it rather than lay around and whine. I was in the industry for 35 years and I do not regret anything. I retired as a Regional Director and I admit, not everyday is fun and exciting. Dealing with HR, terminating reps and DM's are all tasks that I hated, but it was part of the job. I also admit this is a different era now. I have friends that I will have all of my life that are physicians and work within my previous company. I am proud of those products that we introduced and grew in the marketplace. I am also proud of helping the company go from 200 million to well over 5 billion before my retirement. It is not often you have the opportunity to watch a company grow to its present day position from absolutely nothing.

I also think the industry has always operated in cycles and will continue to do that. I enjoyed carrying a bag originally but it was durting a time where I was the only rep in that territory. I may not have enjoyed it as much with 2-3-4 reps selling in the same office from the same company. Obviously, the trend is going back to lower numbers of reps whichwill probably continue. Saying all of this, I think the job stills pride to get back into the position. It is all up to the individual. you can make the job interesting or go through the motions and watch the clock every day. I chose to do the former and I do not regret it.
 




Anonymous said:
I agree that the pharmaceutical industry may not be for everyone. You had the guts to do something about it rather than lay around and whine. I was in the industry for 35 years and I do not regret anything. I retired as a Regional Director and I admit, not everyday is fun and exciting. Dealing with HR, terminating reps and DM's are all tasks that I hated, but it was part of the job. I also admit this is a different era now. I have friends that I will have all of my life that are physicians and work within my previous company. I am proud of those products that we introduced and grew in the marketplace. I am also proud of helping the company go from 200 million to well over 5 billion before my retirement. It is not often you have the opportunity to watch a company grow to its present day position from absolutely nothing.

I also think the industry has always operated in cycles and will continue to do that. I enjoyed carrying a bag originally but it was durting a time where I was the only rep in that territory. I may not have enjoyed it as much with 2-3-4 reps selling in the same office from the same company. Obviously, the trend is going back to lower numbers of reps whichwill probably continue. Saying all of this, I think the job stills pride to get back into the position. It is all up to the individual. you can make the job interesting or go through the motions and watch the clock every day. I chose to do the former and I do not regret it.
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Thanks for your post.
My guess is that when you were working, the industry was respected by outsiders more than it is now. Moreover, if you stayed focused, your company would take care of you.

Now, the outsiders hate us. And companies have no loyalty. You were very lucky to have been with the same company for so long. My generation does not have that luxury. We are just hired hands, waiting for the next downsize call.

Overall, the industry has been good to me for the last 15 years, but with 4 downsizings (despite good to great numbers), its really getting to me. If I had to do it all over again, I would NOT do pharma sales. Actually, I would not even get into sales in the first place. Instead, I would move towards a job in operations or move into law or accounting.

Face it, sales is good for a season. But, to last in sales (sales management is not sales), you just have to kiss too much ass for too long to maintain any sanity.
 




Anonymous said:
Here's an idea for all of you drug reps who find it difficult to do your job and be seen by a physician. Why don't you start trying to be a resource to them instead of just a detailer or sample dropper. Take pride in what you are doing...that is if you have any pride in what you are selling...and find out what they need from you. Create a way for them to talk to you on their own time through your own message board or something. They can drop questions or comments to you when they are online and you can respond back when you are...it doesn't have to be real time.

For example, if you are peddling diabetes meds why not ask a doctor for five minutes to talk about what you could do for him/her that would make their job easier. What are the three biggest obstacles they face when dealing with diabetic patients or patients that are border line. Then figure out a way to help them. Maybe it's sponsoring a health fair at a community center or place of worship if the doc tells you they are having trouble reaching patients because there is a trust issue.

Ok, it's more work on your part but if you really believe in what you do isn't it worth it? My clients are busy too and don't have time to sit with me while I rattle off all the features and benefits of my service, but they have all the time in the world to talk to me when I'm helping them solve their problems.

I can't wait to hear the flack I get for this one...but understand this comes from many conversations with docs and nurse practitioners who tell me constantly they value the information drug companies can provide. Real info that helps them do their jobs.
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Gee you are out of the box. I should take your advise. I want to be winner like you. I have spent the day with your type. You are still talking through the door after it has been closed in your face. Do you sell off label
 




"Why don't you start trying to be a resource to them instead of just a detailer or sample dropper. Take pride in what you are doing...that is if you have any pride in what you are selling...and find out what they need from you. Create a way for them to talk to you on their own time through your own message board or something. "

Sure - message board - facebbok site - twitter- all great ideas if your in 'real' sales, but c'mon this is pharma, having a facebook site for work stuff definatley has to violate some policy whether pharma code, company or otherwise. All creative thinking that actually helps customers is against the pharma code, you have to know that.
 




Passage of the Whistleblower Protection Enhancement Act must be a priority for the lame duck session of Congress.

We are facing a looming crisis because we have not heeded the warnings from our federal whistleblowers. Right now we need to enact strong enact strong legislation to protect federal whistleblowers. Protecting whistleblowers is a reform that has strong bilateral support across ideological lines. Federal employees, the foot soldiers in the war on waste, fraud and abuse, need to get the protections they deserve. They must be able to fight back when they are fired, harassed or demoted in retaliation for their efforts to protect the public health and safety and taxpayer dollars.

http://www.change.org/medicalwhistleblower/petitions/view/enact_whistleblower_protection_now

Join Medical Whistleblower Advocacy Network:
http://www.change.org/medicalwhistleblower

See our active petitions at: http://www.change.org/medicalwhistleblower/petitions
 




Anonymous said:
I too felt embarrassed to be in pharma and while it took my a year to get out (prior to the market crash) I finally did. I remember almost every day starting my car and putting my head on the steering wheel and sighing for a good 15 seconds. The bottomline is that if you want to make a difference for your own personal good and the community, being a drug rep probably isn't the job for you. When I talk to people about being a drug rep they talk about the perks they get as reps. Maybe the drug industry should rethink their hires.

On the device side I am not saying it is any better. Because device reps are paid significantly more than most sales fields all you tend to hear us talk about is money, etc.

People are people. My Doctors I sell to aren't saints either. With my device they want to know how much it costs and how much can bill medicare for it's use. Then you see them doing the math in their head, smile and sign.

Self perservation i guess.
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Then the Docs ask if you pay for endorsments,lol.http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2010/11/24/video-drug-companies-corrupting-physicians/?iref=allsearch
 




Anonymous said:
I am a transition success story! So it's possible but it is a serious challenge.

In 2005 I left a Specialty Position which provided me with an income of about $120,000 per year. I was sick of not being able to advance, not being respected. I was one of those types that was very clinical and tried to sell to the correct patient type.

I left the industry-period-I had no job and I dedicated myself to finding a new job. I was headed towards Medical Equipment (where I actually started my career). No one would even consider me and it sucked, especially since my first job was with Smith and Nephew! I got all the same negative responses that have been stated in previous posts.

My plan had been to stay at the same pay range which after 3 months of interviewing and no hard offer on the table became obsolete.

As concern turned to despair I went to work for an organization that was affiliated with the FDA. My job was as a telemarketer that bought in $48,000 per year. Yes that's right-I thought my pharma job sucked:)! I hadn't made this little since I graduated college 15 years prior. Plus I had not had an income for 5 months during my job search.

Let me tell you folk, I held a second job on the side in a retail store just to keep my house; I took public transportation everywhere because I didn't have a car. Every luxury I knew left my life. I worked 24/7.

For those of you who know the politics of trying to get noticed or promoted in pharma and for those of you who actually did learn how to sell in Pharma training-this is where luck and hard work will kick in. About 3 months into my new job, my boss, as well as everyone up to the CEO of the organization was thrilled with my success in my telemarketing role. I was called in to meet with the CEO and I was promoted to an outside sales position the next month where the base salary was now $65,000 plus some perks (Thank god at least I was on my way).

Over the next year I called on every skill set I ever learned in the past. Today (I have been with the organization almost 2 years), I am the Director of Sales and I am being groomed to become the new VP of Sales and Marketing. I have surpassed my original income level and I know that I can now work for any company.

As you can tell by the length of this post the journey was anything but easy. It was humiliating and hard but it proves that you can move on. Hopefully my post brings attention to the pitfalls as well as the rewards of changing your pharma career path and hopefully my story gave you a good laugh on the way.
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Whoever posted this...thanks for taking the time. I am freshly laid off and still in and out of the pit of despair. The pharma job was death by 10,000 paper cuts. The money was good but watching my colleagues fall one by one, I realized that my time would come as well. They all went back into pharma, which to me seemed like prolonging a terminal disease with a pain killer instead of eradicating it with a cure. This industry is like the mafia; hard to get in and even harder to get out. Did I really believe that I was going to be a 'drug rep' for 25 more years? No. But how do you bail a cozy gig when you have a family and a mortgage?

How many times have you seen that gray haired guy carrying the bag and thrown up a little in your mouth? Or for the ladies, what about when that day comes when your tits start to sag (yes I know you can get that fixed, but everything else will sag around them) and you are competing with a 24 year old cheerleader? This thing is finite.

Hopefully I can post a similar story in the future.
 




Anonymous said:
I got out of pharma 6 months and am in device sales now and doing very very well...so to the people defending pharma, why do my pharma friends keep calling me saying 'get me the hell out of pharma?'

Pharma is a boring job. I felt like i needed to tuck my cock n balls between my legs and prance around...All of the selling skills I learned selling copiers were drained from me. I gained them back after being in pharma for 5 years then going into device. Then I thought the other day...shit I didn't sell in pharma. I marketed well, sure, but i didn't sell anything. It is not sales. It is pharmaceutical marketing. Sales means a signed order. Name one other industry that you are a called a b2b sales rep. yet do not get a signed order? You can't.

My device manager told me the only reason he hired me was because I sold copiers, that pharma was a waste of time in my career and I should have sold copiers longer... and he was right.

I think so many of us talk shit because I WAS the guy I despise so much now, you know, thought I was the shit, mid twenties, making good money in what looked like a hot shot job. It got to me when I realized I wasn't actually producing anything, that my numbers went up or down for things wayyyy the hell out of my control, like losing formulary or no see call lists. In device, I have TRUE ownership of my results. I can't blame it on public aid or the large group that kicked reps. out of their office.

I also think us device reps. do look down on pharma because you can be successful in pharma and bomb in device/surgical. I have seen it before. That being said, I could easily go back into pharma and sell circles around your number 1 reps. Basically, at the risk of being arrogant, pharma reps. can't play in my world (or other device reps./surgical reps. for that matter).

So continue to peddle your me too products and cater to your offices. I haven't given one lunch in the past 6 months as a device reps. and when I cold call offices, my calls always get priority over yours...
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LUV the "tucking the cock and balls comment," that is the most succinct way have heard this job summarized. I always kind of felt like I should sit down to pee when I'm in an office. I started selling copiers, then Paychex, then went to pharma thinking it was the Holy Grail.

About six months ago, I did a lunch with a dick Dr. who told me at the outset that he would not write my product. We had a great clinical discussion. He left the lunch, and as I gathered my things to leave, the MA came in and said the Dr. just Rx'd my drug and wanted samples. For the first time in 10 years I got that thrill that comes with SELLING. It struck me how much I missed that.

Freshly laid off and looking forward to selling something.
 




Anonymous said:
So, you work a job based on what other people think?

You people just over analyze everything. The bottom line is that the job pays good, and compared to other jobs, it pays great.

To continually complain about the status of this job or the fact that we are treated like by management or doctors in some cases, is very foolish.

I choose to stay in this industry because a job to me, is just a job, and I do it well to pay my bills and live, nothing more and nothing less.

"Fucking them is ok, but just stick it in a little bit, not all the way", this is something to keep in mind when you have a situation where the assholes in management are treating you like crap.
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I completely agree, with one exception. You absolutely do not "choose to stay," they choose to let you. All it takes is one counterpart that doesn't like you and calls the ethics hotline on you (true or not), a manager that doesn't like you, a sample error...you name it, and you are burned. Trust me my friend, I was president's club one week, fired the next over something trivial and false. You serve at their pleasure.
 




Anonymous said:
I completely agree, with one exception. You absolutely do not "choose to stay," they choose to let you. All it takes is one counterpart that doesn't like you and calls the ethics hotline on you (true or not), a manager that doesn't like you, a sample error...you name it, and you are burned. Trust me my friend, I was president's club one week, fired the next over something trivial and false. You serve at their pleasure.
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They have many applicants, and most can't sell, and they know they can't sell. That is why they want in, because they can't hide in the pod, and drop off samples, and just skate by.

It makes me sick to see this types everyday. No talent, no drive, yet they get by, year after year, because they get signatures without selling, so it looks like they are working.
 




Anonymous said:
LUV the "tucking the cock and balls comment," that is the most succinct way have heard this job summarized. I always kind of felt like I should sit down to pee when I'm in an office. I started selling copiers, then Paychex, then went to pharma thinking it was the Holy Grail.

About six months ago, I did a lunch with a dick Dr. who told me at the outset that he would not write my product. We had a great clinical discussion. He left the lunch, and as I gathered my things to leave, the MA came in and said the Dr. just Rx'd my drug and wanted samples. For the first time in 10 years I got that thrill that comes with SELLING. It struck me how much I missed that.

Freshly laid off and looking forward to selling something.
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I know what you mean by that THRILL of the close. I found out I landed a 400 thousand dollar deal during a layover last week and had this bounce in my step all afternoon. Did the match and after taxes walk away with with about $22,000 in bonus for next month on that one sale alone.

When I saw a Doctor wrote my RX for the first time it was like "mehhhh thats cool I guess."

You just don't get that thrill in pharma.
 




Anonymous said:
I know what you mean by that THRILL of the close. I found out I landed a 400 thousand dollar deal during a layover last week and had this bounce in my step all afternoon. Did the match and after taxes walk away with with about $22,000 in bonus for next month on that one sale alone.

When I saw a Doctor wrote my RX for the first time it was like "mehhhh thats cool I guess."

You just don't get that thrill in pharma.
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The only thrill you get in pharma is when you drop your manager off after a field ride.
 












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