"CIA"

Anonymous

Guest
The OIG is digging deep into Forest Promotional Activities, prompting additional training for many of you. VP's, Area Directors, RD's, and to some extent, DM's buffer themselves from the battlefield- what goes on daily in front of the MD. Most reps realize that speakers don't always use the slide deck or make an attempt to use the slide deck (btw, what does that mean, making an attempt to use the slide deck?... That the MD's mouse jammed and she could forward the slides? Or PowerPoint encountered multiple errors preventing the MD from opening the deck? Or maybe that the MD forgot to bring their laptop, but they really tried not to forget) Most reps realize that some MDs use samples for a family member or friend; that some calls may not include the necessary fair balance, that MD's that speak (get paid) usually use more of that companies product, that post call notes create documentation against you, never for you- when was the last time u heard a vm stating that Forest was including quality post call notes in the bonus and commission structure? "We want to work with you"- Promotional Guidelines mantra, as one of their goons gets on stage inviting reps to report "curious promotional activity". Call that number and your marked. 3 things happen after that phone call:
1. Compliance measures the amount of risk to the company from the callers event.
2. Compliance assesses collateral damage- who else knows what you know?
3. Compliance isolates you, and notifies a "manager" in your Area. I have proof of all 3.
Most reps know these things are true, and truth be told, so does management. The luxury of management is to say, "C'mon, you know you shouldn't have done that. You know you ant leave samples to an MD as an incentive to increase share. What, you took lunch to a prescriber to grow ur business? What were you thinking?" Common sense left the building sometime back, as did loyalty and integrity. To call this Agreement an "Integrity Agreement" is like Santa Claus. Sure he exists- just like Forest demonstrates integrity. It's a Covers It's Ass agreement. It is not for Your Protection, it's for the companies protection. If you don't sign it, ur fired, if u do sign it, and you hear an MD ask about Viibryd for generalized anxiety, and you or ur counterpart says, viibryd treats depression and dep pts have anxiety, then YOU are subject up to jail.... and if Forest is sued down the road, the CIA says they can come looking for you for money. The CIA is a game, and Forest is a game player, played by smooth talking executives that messed with the government one too many times. Keep this post earmarked for future reference when Forest pays another $200M plus fine in the next 12 months for off label Savella promotion. Uncle Sam doesn't like companies that rip him off, and neither do I.
 






The prior thread brings up a concern that I am surprised no one had brought up prior to this. Glad to see someone else recognizes the issue at hand and the risk all reps (regardless of division) are faced here. You are put in an awful position. Why did the Director of Compliance leave last year? Likely this issue will surface in a bigger way. Don't fall prey to the tactics. Protect yourself. Really the only way is to get out.
 












The OIG is digging deep into Forest Promotional Activities, prompting additional training for many of you. VP's, Area Directors, RD's, and to some extent, DM's buffer themselves from the battlefield- what goes on daily in front of the MD. Most reps realize that speakers don't always use the slide deck or make an attempt to use the slide deck (btw, what does that mean, making an attempt to use the slide deck?... That the MD's mouse jammed and she could forward the slides? Or PowerPoint encountered multiple errors preventing the MD from opening the deck? Or maybe that the MD forgot to bring their laptop, but they really tried not to forget) Most reps realize that some MDs use samples for a family member or friend; that some calls may not include the necessary fair balance, that MD's that speak (get paid) usually use more of that companies product, that post call notes create documentation against you, never for you- when was the last time u heard a vm stating that Forest was including quality post call notes in the bonus and commission structure? "We want to work with you"- Promotional Guidelines mantra, as one of their goons gets on stage inviting reps to report "curious promotional activity". Call that number and your marked. 3 things happen after that phone call:
1. Compliance measures the amount of risk to the company from the callers event.
2. Compliance assesses collateral damage- who else knows what you know?
3. Compliance isolates you, and notifies a "manager" in your Area. I have proof of all 3.
Most reps know these things are true, and truth be told, so does management. The luxury of management is to say, "C'mon, you know you shouldn't have done that. You know you ant leave samples to an MD as an incentive to increase share. What, you took lunch to a prescriber to grow ur business? What were you thinking?" Common sense left the building sometime back, as did loyalty and integrity. To call this Agreement an "Integrity Agreement" is like Santa Claus. Sure he exists- just like Forest demonstrates integrity. It's a Covers It's Ass agreement. It is not for Your Protection, it's for the companies protection. If you don't sign it, ur fired, if u do sign it, and you hear an MD ask about Viibryd for generalized anxiety, and you or ur counterpart says, viibryd treats depression and dep pts have anxiety, then YOU are subject up to jail.... and if Forest is sued down the road, the CIA says they can come looking for you for money. The CIA is a game, and Forest is a game player, played by smooth talking executives that messed with the government one too many times. Keep this post earmarked for future reference when Forest pays another $200M plus fine in the next 12 months for off label Savella promotion. Uncle Sam doesn't like companies that rip him off, and neither do I.



I am glad I am no longer with Forest, but I won't be surprised to see a fine for off label promotion of Savella. I was trained and pushed to sell for 'general' pain conditions. Pretty easy for FDA to track if they look into all of our lunches or calls on doctors that DON'T treat or see fibro patients. Happy to get away from the whips of upper management.
 






Promotional Guielines: 2 activities/HCP/month......that applies to hospital too??.... We are pushed to frequent HVP's and even our RD leaves messages about having more activity. Between so many counterparts, it is difficult to limit activity. Coffees, bagels, scones count as 1 activity, plus a lunch and we are at the maximum.
 


















As a DD, we would never allow anything to slip past us that would warrant any fine, let alone a billion dollars. By the way that would decrease your bonuses. Just sell and do you job properly and you won't have any issues
 






As a DD, we would never allow anything to slip past us that would warrant any fine, let alone a billion dollars. By the way that would decrease your bonuses. Just sell and do you job properly and you won't have any issues


Funny, I am told I must sell Savella on the fact that it has an depression indication, but just not in the US. I'll be fine as long as I do as I am told.
 






Funny, I am told I must sell Savella on the fact that it has an depression indication, but just not in the US. I'll be fine as long as I do as I am told.

You're not getting that direction from corporate so if your DM, RD, or ABD are telling you that you should "sack up" and turn them in to compliance with some proof. Otherwise stop making up BS.
 


















You're not getting that direction from corporate so if your DM, RD, or ABD are telling you that you should "sack up" and turn them in to compliance with some proof. Otherwise stop making up BS.


So maybe I should video or record my next field ride. Maybe keep my iPhone running during our next meeting???? Everyone knows what were doing, but management thinks of they don't talk about it and look the other way it's not happening. Why else would I be required to call on targets that have said for 2 years they DO NOT treat fibro, never have treated fibro, will never diagnosis or treat fibro though I am required to keep calling on them. Our 'fuzzy' pain discussions we do help broaden who should be treated with Savella that aren't fibro patients. Would love to get my out of touch DM hired, but compliance wont have my back.