The tIme has finally arrived, goodbye and good luck!

[Anonymous]

I've been retired a decade but kept in touch with what is now Novartis, as I was a merger legacy, through Cafepharma.

There comes a time though when one leaves the past behind. The pension check is always electronically there and on time. More and more of the people I knew are no longer with the company or industry.

I was a "detail man" and proud of it. I also became an old poop who became what the company and industry wanted me to be. I didn't like it but wanted to hold and leave on my own schedule which I did.

I can't relate any longer to what you go though and experience. It is an entirely different industry. Even as a bookmark, I seldom visit here much any more. At those times, the topics really rarely change.

I wish everyone well. I was fortunate in being here before Novartis and have the fruits of labor that come from it. The time has come to walk away and not look back.

I had a great career and made many friends as well as had a lot of fun. I wish the same for all of you. Things will eventually come around full circle and there won't even be sales data used in evaluations. I saw DDD at its beginnings and between the cost of data and government regulation, I think most of you will work without physician data, etc. just like we did for so many years.

May you be happy always!

So long.

 

[Anonymous]

I've been retired a decade but kept in touch with what is now Novartis, as I was a merger legacy, through Cafepharma.

There comes a time though when one leaves the past behind. The pension check is always electronically there and on time. More and more of the people I knew are no longer with the company or industry.

I was a "detail man" and proud of it. I also became an old poop who became what the company and industry wanted me to be. I didn't like it but wanted to hold and leave on my own schedule which I did.

I can't relate any longer to what you go though and experience. It is an entirely different industry. Even as a bookmark, I seldom visit here much any more. At those times, the topics really rarely change.

I wish everyone well. I was fortunate in being here before Novartis and have the fruits of labor that come from it. The time has come to walk away and not look back.

I had a great career and made many friends as well as had a lot of fun. I wish the same for all of you. Things will eventually come around full circle and there won't even be sales data used in evaluations. I saw DDD at its beginnings and between the cost of data and government regulation, I think most of you will work without physician data, etc. just like we did for so many years.

May you be happy always!

So long.

I think Novartis has hired professional reviewers to manage their image on cafepharma…you know it's dubious that a 10 year retiree would jump on cafepharma and post "I loved my job and you will too" post.

 

[Anonymous]

I think Novartis has hired professional reviewers to manage their image on cafepharma…you know it's dubious that a 10 year retiree would jump on cafepharma and post "I loved my job and you will too" post.

The previous CEO stated publically he monitors Cafepharma. HR monitors daily and has approached leadership about comments. As much as people dismiss what is said on these boards, the comments get attention from corporate. Novartis image is terrible from many who work here and probably worse externally with all the lawsuits in the news. Detail reps will turn to customer service reps even more than it is now. Start learning how to trick your manager on ride alongs that you are adding value to the patients lives. Time is ticking on calling yourself in sales or a sales rep. Read GSK board.

 

[Anonymous]

I know that reps used to love this job, especially before the merger. They made good money, retired with large pensions plus 401K's, and have their health care covered for life. Why wouldn't these guys check back in? They are lucky to be old, not fighting the environment today They probably are relieved that they dodged the bullet

 

[Anonymous]

I know that reps used to love this job, especially before the merger. They made good money, retired with large pensions plus 401K's, and have their health care covered for life. Why wouldn't these guys check back in? They are lucky to be old, not fighting the environment today They probably are relieved that they dodged the bullet

As another old timer, I agree with everything you say. A number of us have attempted to stay in touch with the company and the job through this website. The more years past the merger however the likelihood of why we would do so becomes less and less. Don't take this the wrong way as your job is now almost a complete 180 from what ours was. There are some of us though that aren't that old. We got out early after the merger and probably the last of us are starting to collect Medicare now in addition to our pensions, IRA's and 401k's.

Good luck to those who carry the bag now. I wouldn't and couldn't do your job if I were starting out now. It is an entirely different business climate and world. You have the skills and smarts to adapt and succeed. Like the other gent, I wish you well.

 

[Anonymous]

As another old timer, I agree with everything you say. A number of us have attempted to stay in touch with the company and the job through this website. The more years past the merger however the likelihood of why we would do so becomes less and less. Don't take this the wrong way as your job is now almost a complete 180 from what ours was. There are some of us though that aren't that old. We got out early after the merger and probably the last of us are starting to collect Medicare now in addition to our pensions, IRA's and 401k's.

Good luck to those who carry the bag now. I wouldn't and couldn't do your job if I were starting out now. It is an entirely different business climate and world. You have the skills and smarts to adapt and succeed. Like the other gent, I wish you well.

Most don't even have the education to be High School Health teachers.

 

[Anonymous]

As another old timer, I agree with everything you say. A number of us have attempted to stay in touch with the company and the job through this website. The more years past the merger however the likelihood of why we would do so becomes less and less. Don't take this the wrong way as your job is now almost a complete 180 from what ours was. There are some of us though that aren't that old. We got out early after the merger and probably the last of us are starting to collect Medicare now in addition to our pensions, IRA's and 401k's.

Good luck to those who carry the bag now. I wouldn't and couldn't do your job if I were starting out now. It is an entirely different business climate and world. You have the skills and smarts to adapt and succeed. Like the other gent, I wish you well.

Thanks "detailman" along with your crew from a distant era for the times you have spent on this board and the Novartis section in particular. The observations, reflections and insights all of you have periodically shared with "sales reps" like myself has not gone unnoticed and gratefully accepted. It's too bad that gents like yourselves are finally coming to the conclusion the time has come for you to leave the board. I wish you'd reconsider but I understand your perspectives. I wish you the best that life has to offer.

 

[Anonymous]

………...
Good luck to those who carry the bag now. I wouldn't and couldn't do your job if I were starting out now. It is an entirely different business climate and world. You have the skills and smarts to adapt and succeed. Like the other gent, I wish you well.

You're deluded. You'd jump at this job if you were starting out now - and would be better off for it because you wouldn't know how good it was. The fact you say it was better…means nothing - Reps have been bitch'n about their job 4 EVAR...

 

[Anonymous]

You're deluded. You'd jump at this job if you were starting out now - and would be better off for it because you wouldn't know how good it was. The fact you say it was better…means nothing - Reps have been bitch'n about their job 4 EVAR...

I'm one of the few, pre-merger, lifelong detailmen who still occasionally read and post on this Board. I have to completely disagree with you.

I've never complained about my job pre-merger and the first two years after it. I did become dissatisfied with it well into the third year of the merger which continued to grow until I retired shortly afterward. I saw it was a new job, new company, new philosophy of business, new everything and that I, along with most of my detailperson colleagues did not fit in. The times had changed, neither for the worse or the better, but in ways that we were unable to adapt to in a satisfactory manner worthy of the company or ourselves. As I saw the merged company grow, expand and hire new and very young and relatively inexperience people, I realized that their education, life experience and skill sets were much more positively in line with the organization's needs. Young people with new ideas and skill sets were and remain the future.

I thank all of you for your dedication and hard work. It is because of you that I don't have to worry about my pension check being deposited on time each month. Please know I'm very sincere when I say that.

The skill sets we needed were completely different than those you need and use today. We saw 5-7 docs a day with 1 or 2 pharmacies. The average office call lasted 10-15 minutes with many between 20-30 minutes. They were actual presentations, science based with some marketing thrown in but also "closing" for the sale based on the long-term relationships we built with the physicians over years and decades.

We didn't provide lunches. We couldn't and were specifically not permitted to do so. No doctors asked for them either. We couldn't even buy a soda for anyone. Our expense accounts were basic: gas, oil changes, postage and office supplies making up the vast majority of them. There was a per diem for our own lunch which was a nice perk until it was removed right before the merger. Heck, we used our personal credit cards and cash for expenses and were reimbursed for them each month.

Sample drops didn't exist. Target lists didn't exist. Voice mail didn't exist and when it was first introduced, only RMs and then DMs had it for the first 2-3 years. We had one person per territory and sold the entire product line.

I, and my compatriot detailpersons, as we did have some women in our ranks, could not work in your "sales" world today. It's simply an old school compared to a new school comparison.

You have to work on the "1 minute or less" principle. You have: trackers, reports, "analytical data" (which I put in quotes because I think my group knew our physicians better than any Rx data provided to you now), metrics, etc. that would have been our downfall.

The job is different from what it was in the 60's through the first two years after the merger and what it became from two years post merger. How many reps or DM's do you see retire now? How many get genuine retirement parties where an RM and home office people attend? Do you get a holiday gift around Thanksgiving and Christmas now?

Here's a good example I think. I was at a national sales meeting of all 524 reps and DMs in the mid 80's. One of our kids was having a significant health challenge at that time. The VP of Sales made it a point to seek me out and genuinely ask how our child was and if there was anything the company and himself could do for us? The company was a corporate family in its own real sense.

I'm not saying "big is bad," because it necessarily is not. I'm saying those of us who are still occasionally reading and contributing here were "detailmen" not salesmen and that truly is a significant difference. It's why we couldn't do your jobs now and why you couldn't have done our jobs in our time. I had the same manager for almost 20 years when I first began my career. I wrote a one page report and mailed it to him each Friday. Basic stuff: daily number of docs and pharms seen and anything of importance I thought he should inform the home office about in his weekly report. No voice mails and only an infrequent night call between 7:30 and 8:30 where the first thing said was "I'm sorry to call you at home, if this is a bad time would tomorrow night be better?" Those were usually to clarify something from my weekly report.

Your work world is a vastly different one than mine was. You have to know so much more than we did and have so many different expectations placed on you. I genuinely think your job is harder today. I am grateful to all of you for your hard work.

 

[Anonymous]

Nice post old timer.....I started just pre-merger and you are correct, it is a whole different world today. There is survival for those of us with some skills, but most of the new hires were not brought in for their 'detail' abilities. It used to be managers were promoted from within, we got education/training on critical functions related to individual jobs, people cared for and looked out for one another.

The downfall was the inability of management to make their own decisions - whether the couldn't or weren't allowed to is open for discussion. This brought in the consultants. They never spent a day in the field, never saw a doc or pharm, yet they knew how to grow our business. Saturation was the buzz and all the companies jumped on board - and with so many me too drugs being hawked, bribery was the way to production.

Unfortuantely, it seems nobody ever thought about the ethics of what the process had become, it was all about market share and dollars earned. I guess the pendulum swings both ways and we're now on the way back across. Hopefully it becomes a bit more like the old days, but I'm afraid it never can go there, the 'shareholder first' climate won't allow that.

Good luck with your future endeavors, I'll be following shortly (maybe really shortly). At least we take great memories and a nice pension off into the sunset! Adios!

 

[Anonymous]

Old timers, "detailpersons"....please stick around. You have a lot to offer us.

 

[Anonymous]

I come in, again, for the first time in six months and see that the 21st Century Novartis continues to be radically different from its original edition.

Not for the better in the mind of this 10+ year retiree who put in 30 years with one of the parent companies, pre-merger.

Good luck to one and all. It's a completely different world between being a detailman and a pharmaceutical salesperson.

 

[Anonymous]

I'm one of the few, pre-merger, lifelong detailmen who still occasionally read and post on this Board. I have to completely disagree with you.

I've never complained about my job pre-merger and the first two years after it. I did become dissatisfied with it well into the third year of the merger which continued to grow until I retired shortly afterward. I saw it was a new job, new company, new philosophy of business, new everything and that I, along with most of my detailperson colleagues did not fit in. The times had changed, neither for the worse or the better, but in ways that we were unable to adapt to in a satisfactory manner worthy of the company or ourselves. As I saw the merged company grow, expand and hire new and very young and relatively inexperience people, I realized that their education, life experience and skill sets were much more positively in line with the organization's needs. Young people with new ideas and skill sets were and remain the future.

I thank all of you for your dedication and hard work. It is because of you that I don't have to worry about my pension check being deposited on time each month. Please know I'm very sincere when I say that.

The skill sets we needed were completely different than those you need and use today. We saw 5-7 docs a day with 1 or 2 pharmacies. The average office call lasted 10-15 minutes with many between 20-30 minutes. They were actual presentations, science based with some marketing thrown in but also "closing" for the sale based on the long-term relationships we built with the physicians over years and decades.

We didn't provide lunches. We couldn't and were specifically not permitted to do so. No doctors asked for them either. We couldn't even buy a soda for anyone. Our expense accounts were basic: gas, oil changes, postage and office supplies making up the vast majority of them. There was a per diem for our own lunch which was a nice perk until it was removed right before the merger. Heck, we used our personal credit cards and cash for expenses and were reimbursed for them each month.

Sample drops didn't exist. Target lists didn't exist. Voice mail didn't exist and when it was first introduced, only RMs and then DMs had it for the first 2-3 years. We had one person per territory and sold the entire product line.

I, and my compatriot detailpersons, as we did have some women in our ranks, could not work in your "sales" world today. It's simply an old school compared to a new school comparison.

You have to work on the "1 minute or less" principle. You have: trackers, reports, "analytical data" (which I put in quotes because I think my group knew our physicians better than any Rx data provided to you now), metrics, etc. that would have been our downfall.

The job is different from what it was in the 60's through the first two years after the merger and what it became from two years post merger. How many reps or DM's do you see retire now? How many get genuine retirement parties where an RM and home office people attend? Do you get a holiday gift around Thanksgiving and Christmas now?

Here's a good example I think. I was at a national sales meeting of all 524 reps and DMs in the mid 80's. One of our kids was having a significant health challenge at that time. The VP of Sales made it a point to seek me out and genuinely ask how our child was and if there was anything the company and himself could do for us? The company was a corporate family in its own real sense.

I'm not saying "big is bad," because it necessarily is not. I'm saying those of us who are still occasionally reading and contributing here were "detailmen" not salesmen and that truly is a significant difference. It's why we couldn't do your jobs now and why you couldn't have done our jobs in our time. I had the same manager for almost 20 years when I first began my career. I wrote a one page report and mailed it to him each Friday. Basic stuff: daily number of docs and pharms seen and anything of importance I thought he should inform the home office about in his weekly report. No voice mails and only an infrequent night call between 7:30 and 8:30 where the first thing said was "I'm sorry to call you at home, if this is a bad time would tomorrow night be better?" Those were usually to clarify something from my weekly report.

Your work world is a vastly different one than mine was. You have to know so much more than we did and have so many different expectations placed on you. I genuinely think your job is harder today. I am grateful to all of you for your hard work.

Great post! I remember those days, and they were good...

 

[Anonymous]

Zelnorm baby