ortho reps vs Ethicon

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Anonymous

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Now that Ortho is a call point for me with Stratafix, Prineo, etc, it has opened my eyes to exactly what the ortho reps do. Or in other words, how bad my job sucks at Ethicon.

These guys got it easy. They stick with a handful or surgeons. Show up, help set up, bill, and haul ass. And, they get paid from dollar one.

They are never loitering around, standing at scrub sinks, trolling for business in lounges, etc. Sure they have to work on the weekends some but I think this might be the only downside. Plus, I think they make more.

Do these guys even have to cold call and grow business? It just seems like they have a reason to be there are welcome.
 












You clearly have no idea what your talking about. Ortho is the most competitive landscape by far, tons of companies and a few Big Boys to battle with every day. Your business can be dependent on 1-4 surgeons and if any leave or geographically move you can be crushed. I have sold in Ortho and now do in CTS, CTS is by far the easiest in comparison. The upside on ortho is HUGE but it is a daily battle to keep the business you have. Granted their are many old established reps who have control of their accounts very well but by no means is it easier. Don't forget they are running trays around everyday, all night, constantly making sure accounts have not lost or ruined instrumentation. Ortho and AAA reps are generally the only reps that NEED to be in the OR daily.
 






Anonymous said:
You clearly have no idea what your talking about. Ortho is the most competitive landscape by far, tons of companies and a few Big Boys to battle with every day. Your business can be dependent on 1-4 surgeons and if any leave or geographically move you can be crushed. I have sold in Ortho and now do in CTS, CTS is by far the easiest in comparison. The upside on ortho is HUGE but it is a daily battle to keep the business you have. Granted their are many old established reps who have control of their accounts very well but by no means is it easier. Don't forget they are running trays around everyday, all night, constantly making sure accounts have not lost or ruined instrumentation. Ortho and AAA reps are generally the only reps that NEED to be in the OR daily.
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No, you have no idea. Sure, it is competitive like anything else in med device. The difference is you guys are carying trays around, getting set up etc. You work hard to protect the business and the docs using your stuff...true.
But, you are not fighting for growth everyday by calling on competitive guys. I know all the ortho reps by first name and work sided by side with them. You don't see a Stryker rep waiting for a S & N doc and the scrub sink. It's not a cat and mouse game like Cov and Ethicon. These guys work side by side in the hospital. The stick with their docs and the other rep sticks with theirs. No trying to steal business every frickin day because u r paid from dollar one.
These ortho reps put in long hours but no stress!! It's not cold calling everyday like we do a lot
 






YOU GUYS DONT SELL YOU ADMIN THE CONTRACTS> The old timers in EES 1992-1994 who sold without contracts sold. Thats why you are loosing your business . YOU ADMIN A COMMODITY PRODUCT. Why do you think the first exodus was when they changed the draw to a salary . Evolution of a company . EES once was sales driven company now it's market driven.
Ortho guys have it the toughest they work for a distributor they don't even own the business they own the relationship. Most are 1099 so they make alot more than EES reps . They probably pay more in taxes than you will ver earn
 






Anonymous said:
YOU GUYS DONT SELL YOU ADMIN THE CONTRACTS> The old timers in EES 1992-1994 who sold without contracts sold. Thats why you are loosing your business . YOU ADMIN A COMMODITY PRODUCT. Why do you think the first exodus was when they changed the draw to a salary . Evolution of a company . EES once was sales driven company now it's market driven.
Ortho guys have it the toughest they work for a distributor they don't even own the business they own the relationship. Most are 1099 so they make alot more than EES reps . They probably pay more in taxes than you will ver earn
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Wrong again. You say we have a commodity product? I agree. Now try to GROW business with that in your bag!! We are paid on growth and expected to grow. Dollar 1 is for wussies. All you got to do is protect your 5 guys. 1 Specialty. How easy is that!!

The ortho guys in my territory would get their ass handed to them trying to sell the crap we sell to every specialty. Hospitals dont want us there, we have me too prodcuts, contract rule, but still grow business. We hunt every day because we have to. Cant just show up and stand around in cases unless there is growth opportunity.

When is the last time you chased a competitive surgeon? So funny how ortho has always thought they were so cool and top of the food chain. Ethicon is waaay harder hands down!!
 






Anonymous said:
Wrong again. You say we have a commodity product? I agree. Now try to GROW business with that in your bag!! We are paid on growth and expected to grow. Dollar 1 is for wussies. All you got to do is protect your 5 guys. 1 Specialty. How easy is that!!

The ortho guys in my territory would get their ass handed to them trying to sell the crap we sell to every specialty. Hospitals dont want us there, we have me too prodcuts, contract rule, but still grow business. We hunt every day because we have to. Cant just show up and stand around in cases unless there is growth opportunity.

When is the last time you chased a competitive surgeon? So funny how ortho has always thought they were so cool and top of the food chain. Ethicon is waaay harder hands down!!
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Did you ever think the ortho guys are using their time wisely because the competitive guys aren't worth the time or risk in leaving their top customers vulnerable? You do know the ortho reps have to be there while Ethicon is not needed after 2-6 cases.

The difference in working the Ethicon job by a good rep 3 days a week or 6 days a week might be worth 10-15k a year. If you're working harder than that, you are targeting poorly. If I were a DM I'd rather have a team of good reps working 3 days a week with the right surgeons then "johnny hustle" spinning his wheels, working 6 days a week and annoying customers.

Sincerely,
Efficient Ethicon Rep,
 






I've done both. Ortho isn't really a "sales" job unless you're selling trauma and chasing down hip fractures and the like. Most ortho docs will try a different nail or plating system if you're willing to put the work in. On the ofher hand, unless a competitor completely shits the bed, or your company comes out with something totally unique, converting a total joint surgeon takes years. That said, the top ortho sales teams in my territory have a few guys that are accountable for hitting a number who are supported by a team of dolts that run trays and cover cases. Its mostly about protecting what you've got and building the righ relationships to pounce when an opportunity presents itself. I'm in no way saying it's easy, just different from surgical device sales.

Surgical device definitely requires more of a hunter mentality, you can't just sell to a handful of docs and make money. Instead you have to convert entire ORs (or hospital systems), and move on to the next one, to keep hitting your number year after year. I don't care how good your contract position is, getting 30 surgeons from different specialties to all agree to use your stuff is a challenge.

Both can be challenging and financially rewarding, really depends (as always) on the territory and your situation. For me, ortho was a lot of fun because reps are really considered part of the team when it comes to use of the product. However, I didn't work for one of the "big boys" so case coverage became an issue as my business grew. Device ultimately ended up being a more consistent and reliable career path. One thing is for sure, I would have loved to get paid from dollar one in device, but the salary, car and health insurance are good perks that probably even it out.
 






Ortho verus Ethicon rep? There is very little comparison except connections to the OR. Don't let the image fool you, there is a great deal of competition between Ortho reps and companies. The job can be very rewarding financially but reps must work hard and be there available at cases 24/7. There is a great deal of selling over the competition that takes place during the case. It is true that they get very close to their surgeons and are considered to be part of the team. An Ethicon rep is hardly a good comparison because the need to have them present at cases is minimal in comparison and contracts drive the business more than anything else today. Ethicon, like Covidian, is a good place to get your feet wet in devices, but more challenging device positions exist in other companies. Take this from a device rep who worked at Ethicon Endosurgery for years but has moved on.
 
























Anonymous said:
Being in the OR is boring no matter what case you are in and think you are "adding value"
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You are saying that now because Ethicon products are not complicated products that you need to be in cases each time, have a quick learning curve and don't require many interchangeable parts during the procedure. As a result, the time spent in the OR is boring and you feel like you are adding little value. That is not always the case with other companies. This is one of the reasons why a job with Ethicon is a good entry level position in medical device sales but is not good long term.
 






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