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What are you reps going to do when interferon is no longer needed in 3years and don't give me the bullshit about your pipeline because the thought leaders think the molecules are not that good. We here at Merck are just as nervous!!!
 






A. I doubt you are a really a Merck rep, since your implanted chip would not allow CF posting
B. 3 years is a bit optimistic, though we all hope it happens for patients sake.
C. We'll get jobs with whichever company sells these products and take 90% market again.
 






Anonymous said:
A. I doubt you are a really a Merck rep, since your implanted chip would not allow CF posting
B. 3 years is a bit optimistic, though we all hope it happens for patients sake.
C. We'll get jobs with whichever company sells these products and take 90% market again.
Click to expand...

What the hell is CF posting? Might you mean CP posting brilliant one?
Oh that's right! You are a BIOTECH rep. No reason for you to know who to spell Pharma.
 






Anonymous said:
What the hell is CF posting? Might you mean CP posting brilliant one?
Oh that's right! You are a BIOTECH rep. No reason for you to know who to spell Pharma.
Click to expand...

Well, you sure got me on that one! I guess I should retract my past statement due to keystroke error. Just answer the damned post and quit your friggin spelling nazi impersonation!
 






Anonymous said:
What are you reps going to do when interferon is no longer needed in 3years and don't give me the bullshit about your pipeline because the thought leaders think the molecules are not that good. We here at Merck are just as nervous!!!
Click to expand...

1. 2014 is defionately very optimistic
2. There is not a single 'All Oral" study that shows anything close to the efficacy of the current standard of care, for Genotype 1 patients, which are the hardest to treat, and most prevalent. Pharmasetts tiny study was on Genotype 2/3 easy to treat patients.
3. There have been many "Can't miss" opportunities that "missed", even in HCV, remember "albinterfuron"? Once a month vs. one a week for Pegasys. IT MISSED!
4. Pegasys will not disappear simply because of new treatment options. It will simply get a smaller piece, of a much larger pie.
5. Genetech actually does have a pipeline (whether YOU are impressed or not), they also have the cash to invest in other business development deals.
6. The are a limited number of reps who have HCV experience, and relationships. By far, the premiere organization in HCV is Genentech; this is not even debatable! So as these new molecules hit the market, who do you think will the best access to those jobs? Well, the answer is the small number of reps with HCV experience, ESPECIALLY Pegasys reps.

You see, more options in the market mean more opportunities for more money for those that are experienced in that market. So mr./ms. "Smug"; the sky is not falling for HCV reps, the future is actually pretty rosey, whether at genentech or at one of the many other companies that will enter the market in the next five years. Thanks for reminding us of the great position HCV reps are in.

AKA, I no longer work for genentech, but am familiar with the market. So no koolaid here!
 






Anonymous said:
Well, you sure got me on that one! I guess I should retract my past statement due to keystroke error. Just answer the damned post and quit your friggin spelling nazi impersonation!
Click to expand...

Uh huh, keystroke error the F key and the P key are right next to each other. Let's face it you thought the word was Farmaceutical.
 


















Anonymous said:
1. 2014 is defionately very optimistic
2. There is not a single 'All Oral" study that shows anything close to the efficacy of the current standard of care, for Genotype 1 patients, which are the hardest to treat, and most prevalent. Pharmasetts tiny study was on Genotype 2/3 easy to treat patients.
3. There have been many "Can't miss" opportunities that "missed", even in HCV, remember "albinterfuron"? Once a month vs. one a week for Pegasys. IT MISSED!
4. Pegasys will not disappear simply because of new treatment options. It will simply get a smaller piece, of a much larger pie.
5. Genetech actually does have a pipeline (whether YOU are impressed or not), they also have the cash to invest in other business development deals.
6. The are a limited number of reps who have HCV experience, and relationships. By far, the premiere organization in HCV is Genentech; this is not even debatable! So as these new molecules hit the market, who do you think will the best access to those jobs? Well, the answer is the small number of reps with HCV experience, ESPECIALLY Pegasys reps.

You see, more options in the market mean more opportunities for more money for those that are experienced in that market. So mr./ms. "Smug"; the sky is not falling for HCV reps, the future is actually pretty rosey, whether at genentech or at one of the many other companies that will enter the market in the next five years. Thanks for reminding us of the great position HCV reps are in.

AKA, I no longer work for genentech, but am familiar with the market. So no koolaid here!
Click to expand...

You are delusional. BMS and Gilead both have Virology (Hepatitis and HIV) reps and their reps will get the first (and most) spots when it comes to marketing their new (VRUS and INHX) molecules. Vertex reps are thinking they are going to get these jobs as well. So are Gilead and BMS reps for that matter I'm sure.

You can continue to think that there is no all oral data out there just because someone up the ladder told you that This thinking reminds me of what a Merck spokesman said on Monday at the Morgan Stanley Health Conference in San Fran that Merck is the only company with a pangenomic protease yet ACHN showed great data (Genotypes 1,2&3) that very morning at the same conference. It was an obvious slight at the success ACHN had shown but instead of acknowledging the data, Merck chose to act as if it's data is the only relevant data out there. Reality and the market will sort this out for Merck in short order.

Pegasys will disappear. Period.

Yes, Merck has a very murky pipeline and hasn't shown any convincing data - only rhetoric like "we will do whatever it takes to be a leader in HCV" as was stated on Tuesday in San Fran. IDIX has a nuc out there for sale but, while effective, it's slow. The recent purchases of ANDS, INHX and VRUS have left Merck bitter and reaching for answers. Merck had better hurry because the pipeline is dull more molecules are needed to compete in the one pill once a day paradigm that is about to hit the HCV world.
 






Anonymous said:
You are delusional. BMS and Gilead both have Virology (Hepatitis and HIV) reps and their reps will get the first (and most) spots when it comes to marketing their new (VRUS and INHX) molecules. Vertex reps are thinking they are going to get these jobs as well. So are Gilead and BMS reps for that matter I'm sure.

You can continue to think that there is no all oral data out there just because someone up the ladder told you that This thinking reminds me of what a Merck spokesman said on Monday at the Morgan Stanley Health Conference in San Fran that Merck is the only company with a pangenomic protease yet ACHN showed great data (Genotypes 1,2&3) that very morning at the same conference. It was an obvious slight at the success ACHN had shown but instead of acknowledging the data, Merck chose to act as if it's data is the only relevant data out there. Reality and the market will sort this out for Merck in short order.

Pegasys will disappear. Period.

Yes, Merck has a very murky pipeline and hasn't shown any convincing data - only rhetoric like "we will do whatever it takes to be a leader in HCV" as was stated on Tuesday in San Fran. IDIX has a nuc out there for sale but, while effective, it's slow. The recent purchases of ANDS, INHX and VRUS have left Merck bitter and reaching for answers. Merck had better hurry because the pipeline is dull more molecules are needed to compete in the one pill once a day paradigm that is about to hit the HCV world.
Click to expand...

Even with your crazy long answer, you still miss the point. Yes eventually pegasys will disappear, as does every drug, however we are s good 3 years, at least way from the launch of an all oral treat. This hardly counts as "days being numbered". In addition, there is not a single late stage all oral trial showing superiority is genotype 1, not a single one! Next, Roche also has a pipeline,AND the money to acquire companies or compounds to augment said pipeline. Lastly, athe final assuming Roche has no pipeline, and all of these regimens have no side effects and launch in 3 years simutaneously, pegasys will not die instantly. Again, neither bms nor Gilead has an HCV sales force, neither of them knows the HCV, neither has gastro relationships. HIV and HCV are treated by different customers.

In the final analysis, we are several years from having to worry about this. Also, the huge expansion in the marketplace will bring exceptional opportunity for Roche hcv, either at Roche, or highly sought after by the new entrants.

so no Sparky, the sky is not falling, the future is indeed bright for us. We are the best reps' in the most explosive phama area, with absolutely no competition for the next three years at least. I say the is a very envious position to be in.
 






Anonymous said:
Even with your crazy long answer, you still miss the point. Yes eventually pegasys will disappear, as does every drug, however we are s good 3 years, at least way from the launch of an all oral treat. This hardly counts as "days being numbered". In addition, there is not a single late stage all oral trial showing superiority is genotype 1, not a single one! Next, Roche also has a pipeline,AND the money to acquire companies or compounds to augment said pipeline. Lastly, athe final assuming Roche has no pipeline, and all of these regimens have no side effects and launch in 3 years simutaneously, pegasys will not die instantly. Again, neither bms nor Gilead has an HCV sales force, neither of them knows the HCV, neither has gastro relationships. HIV and HCV are treated by different customers.

In the final analysis, we are several years from having to worry about this. Also, the huge expansion in the marketplace will bring exceptional opportunity for Roche hcv, either at Roche, or highly sought after by the new entrants.

so no Sparky, the sky is not falling, the future is indeed bright for us. We are the best reps' in the most explosive phama area, with absolutely no competition for the next three years at least. I say the is a very envious position to be in.
Click to expand...

Jeezus you Stupid Drug Rep you are one who doesnt get it. BMS & Gilead have relationships with GIs & ISs via Hep B sales forces.
 












Anonymous said:
Even with your crazy long answer, you still miss the point. Yes eventually pegasys will disappear, as does every drug, however we are s good 3 years, at least way from the launch of an all oral treat. This hardly counts as "days being numbered". In addition, there is not a single late stage all oral trial showing superiority is genotype 1, not a single one! Next, Roche also has a pipeline,AND the money to acquire companies or compounds to augment said pipeline. Lastly, athe final assuming Roche has no pipeline, and all of these regimens have no side effects and launch in 3 years simutaneously, pegasys will not die instantly. Again, neither bms nor Gilead has an HCV sales force, neither of them knows the HCV, neither has gastro relationships. HIV and HCV are treated by different customers.

In the final analysis, we are several years from having to worry about this. Also, the huge expansion in the marketplace will bring exceptional opportunity for Roche hcv, either at Roche, or highly sought after by the new entrants.

so no Sparky, the sky is not falling, the future is indeed bright for us. We are the best reps' in the most explosive phama area, with absolutely no competition for the next three years at least. I say the is a very envious position to be in.
Click to expand...

Again, you think you are informed, but listening to your manager spout golden rhetoric won't get you anywhere. The phase II trials going on with many of the current products aren't producing the same failures that the phase II HCV trials from years ago did. Genotype 1 data looks good for many companies - do your research, dummy. Do you even know what happened in San Fran this past week?

Three years away? You are nuts (and clueless). It's less than three years before Pegasys gets the boot. PSI-7977 is expected to be filed next year. The future of HCV involves one pill once a day therapies and does not include Pegasys or RBV. If Roche buys IDIX you have a slow nuke, if it doesn't you don't have a pipeline that won't be mature in time to compete with Gilead or BMS and to make matters worse, Roche's (Read:Anadys' studies) are still using peg-IFN/RBV. And no, they won't launch at the same time as Gilead or BMS - (INX-189 is a year behind PSI-7977. Worse, INH-184, MK-5172, and ACH-1625 are behind INX 189) Either way, have fun playing second fiddle at Roche.

As I stated earlier, and someone else reiterated, Both BMS and GILD have HBV and HIV sales forces and both will recruit from within. By the way, have you seen the emperor's new clothes? The only one envying you is yourself. Do some research and quit relying on your manager, dummy.
 






Anonymous said:
Again, you think you are informed, but listening to your manager spout golden rhetoric won't get you anywhere. The phase II trials going on with many of the current products aren't producing the same failures that the phase II HCV trials from years ago did. Genotype 1 data looks good for many companies - do your research, dummy. Do you even know what happened in San Fran this past week?

Three years away? You are nuts (and clueless). It's less than three years before Pegasys gets the boot. PSI-7977 is expected to be filed next year. The future of HCV involves one pill once a day therapies and does not include Pegasys or RBV. If Roche buys IDIX you have a slow nuke, if it doesn't you don't have a pipeline that won't be mature in time to compete with Gilead or BMS and to make matters worse, Roche's (Read:Anadys' studies) are still using peg-IFN/RBV. And no, they won't launch at the same time as Gilead or BMS - (INX-189 is a year behind PSI-7977. Worse, INH-184, MK-5172, and ACH-1625 are behind INX 189) Either way, have fun playing second fiddle at Roche.

As I stated earlier, and someone else reiterated, Both BMS and GILD have HBV and HIV sales forces and both will recruit from within. By the way, have you seen the emperor's new clothes? The only one envying you is yourself. Do some research and quit relying on your manager, dummy.
Click to expand...

Okay! So I'm a dummy, I admit it! let me see:

*ps I 7977 is in phase 3 trial WITH ribaviran AND peg interferon (market dominated by pegasys. Yup,this is horrible news for Roche hcv reps.
*in December, the results of a phase 2 study, with psi7977 and ribavirin were released, they were impressive. 100% of the easy to treat genotype 2 and 3 patients had svr (n=10). As a world class dummy, I must remind you, this is a phase TWO study with no GENOTYPE ONE patients. Even so, as a phase 2 study, it is multiple years from submission, let alone approval for "all oral". As I said originally, there is not a single all oral study treating genotype type one hcv. Nobody cares about genotype 2 or 3.


http://hepatitiscnewdrugs.blogspot.com/2011/12/psi-7977-plus-ribavirin-newer-era-of.html

What I said above is pure fact, refernced by an attached article. Forget about who will hire who, or who will buy who, or whose pipeline is better. That is all speculative opinio' and means nothing. If you want to dispute this dummies facts please post a link referencing ANY phase 3 all oral study treating genotype type one hcv' or even genotype 2/3. The fact is you won't be able to!

In the meantime, this dummy will continue counting his days, 1050, 1049, 1048, 1047.....
 






Pretty sure Genentech and Merck announced in December 11 and earlier in 2011 that they are collaborating in R&D, and that the sales forces will be collaborating new products together, so not sure why you all aren't on the same team. Quit your finger pointing you all will be working together for the next several years like it or not- probably copromoting Genentech polymerase and the merck phase 2 protease or maybe you'll leave for BMS, Gilead... Vertex is a sinking ship be thankful you're not there drinking cool-aid for the 1 other HCV product they may get???
 






Anonymous said:
Pretty sure Genentech and Merck announced in December 11 and earlier in 2011 that they are collaborating in R&D, and that the sales forces will be collaborating new products together, so not sure why you all aren't on the same team. Quit your finger pointing you all will be working together for the next several years like it or not- probably copromoting Genentech polymerase and the merck phase 2 protease or maybe you'll leave for BMS, Gilead... Vertex is a sinking ship be thankful you're not there drinking cool-aid for the 1 other HCV product they may get???
Click to expand...

Amen, the point I was making is that in the medium term (2-3 years), there is no threat to Roche HCV, as ALL current therapies, including ALL that are in phase 3 include the use of Pegasys. This presents opportunity, and an expanded market, not the doom and gloom that the OP tried to depict.
 






Anonymous said:
Amen, the point I was making is that in the medium term (2-3 years), there is no threat to Roche HCV, as ALL current therapies, including ALL that are in phase 3 include the use of Pegasys. This presents opportunity, and an expanded market, not the doom and gloom that the OP tried to depict.
Click to expand...

While you bring up a few good points, it's time to set down the crack pipe and get to reality. Please feel free to dispute these facts.

1) Our (Roche) HCV sales force is much larger than our good friends at Merck. Same is true with Vertex. Pharma/Biotech sizes sales forces to their competition. We will get a reduction of 25-40 sales reps, most likely 5 or six dm's and at least one RSD to size ourselves with our competition, in tghe near future. Thats why there is so much focus on our development. Its to help us get our next job (inside of or outside of Genentech).

2) WE are the market leader in HCV. There are no imminent threats to Pegasys. That's why its time to downsize. Now is the best time to cut our sales force. Trim the fat. Corporate knows that we won't see a dramatic decrease in market share... How much market share did we lose the last time we cut? Nothing is the right answer.

3) Biosimilliars- Yes, they are coming.

4) Profitability- This may be the most obvious. Cutting the sales force or overhead will make us more profitable. Thats what Basel wants.

THis is why my resume is polished. Don't ignore the obvious.
 






Good, forward-thinking post.
The start should be to reduce DSM's to about 8-10. Give them administrative assistant to handle all the useless crap we have to deal with. There is no reason we need to be in the field constantly when it only disrupts our people and their sales efforts and relationships.
No one would miss a beat, and productivity would go up exponentially.
 






Anonymous said:
While you bring up a few good points, it's time to set down the crack pipe and get to reality. Please feel free to dispute these facts.

1) Our (Roche) HCV sales force is much larger than our good friends at Merck. Same is true with Vertex. Pharma/Biotech sizes sales forces to their competition. We will get a reduction of 25-40 sales reps, most likely 5 or six dm's and at least one RSD to size ourselves with our competition, in tghe near future. Thats why there is so much focus on our development. Its to help us get our next job (inside of or outside of Genentech).

2) WE are the market leader in HCV. There are no imminent threats to Pegasys. That's why its time to downsize. Now is the best time to cut our sales force. Trim the fat. Corporate knows that we won't see a dramatic decrease in market share... How much market share did we lose the last time we cut? Nothing is the right answer.

3) Biosimilliars- Yes, they are coming.

4) Profitability- This may be the most obvious. Cutting the sales force or overhead will make us more profitable. Thats what Basel wants.

THis is why my resume is polished. Don't ignore the obvious.
Click to expand...


Crack head here!
1 and 2) Sales force sizing is constantly re-evaluated, for ALL sales forces. I have already stated that the sheer dominance of Pegasys could cause cuts, as obviously the drug has minimal competition, and pretty much sells itself at this point; the fight against PegIntron is over! However, speculating on the scope and timing of any change is just that, speculation. "trimming" the sales force is not the same as the imminent doom and gloom predicted by the Original poster. There simply is no indication of a pending reduction, so why speculate, and spout numbers as though they were fact?

3) Biosimilars? Why are we even discussing this, the Pegasys patent does not even expire until 2015! Thats 3-4 years before a Biosimilar can hit the market, and that assumes no patent extensions, and that there is interest in pursuing such a drug. In the drug industry, four years is a lifetime.

4) Profitabilty- ALL companies want maximum profitability, not just "BASEL"; and that means all! All considerations of sales force sizing are considered against the backdrop of sales thus profitabilty. With minimal managed care impact (98% parity vs peg intron), pegasys is a highly profitable drug. Drug reps are not really sales people, they are resources that are deployed as tactics; just like TV commercials, Radio ads, bill boards, print ads, teledetailing, etc. Reps are expensive, but there is a reason that they are used, that is "THEY WORK"; this is a fact! It would make little sense to have dramatic cuts in a sales force, when it is clear that they have caused and have sustained such dramatic success. "Tweaking" yes? doom and gloom scenario espoused by the OP, no!


In conclusion, there is no need for alarm, and there is no pending doom and gloom, at least that you or I know of. These are the facts, Pegasys is being studied with EVERY SINGLE DAA drug in the HCV pipeline; Pegasys does not lose its patent for 3-4 years, and there is no know biosimilar in the pipeline; there is no ALL ORAL therapy. in phase 2 or phase 3 for genotype 1 HCV, hence, any ALL ORAL regimen is years away from being a reality; Roche HCV is the most experience and most successful sales force in the burgeoning HCV market. Our reps will be highly sought after, as these new companies come online, as there simply are not many reps with HCV experince, knowledge, and relationships. The fact of the matter is short term (3-4), even if Pegasys is our only product, most of us have nothing at all to worry about; and long term we will have plenty of opportunities. Trust me when I tell you that management worries much more about mass defections, than layoffs of 10 or 15 reps. And yes, like ALL reps, and others, your resume should always be polished, but there is no pending doo and gloom.
 






Anonymous said:
Okay! So I'm a dummy, I admit it! let me see:

*ps I 7977 is in phase 3 trial WITH ribaviran AND peg interferon (market dominated by pegasys. Yup,this is horrible news for Roche hcv reps.
*in December, the results of a phase 2 study, with psi7977 and ribavirin were released, they were impressive. 100% of the easy to treat genotype 2 and 3 patients had svr (n=10). As a world class dummy, I must remind you, this is a phase TWO study with no GENOTYPE ONE patients. Even so, as a phase 2 study, it is multiple years from submission, let alone approval for "all oral". As I said originally, there is not a single all oral study treating genotype type one hcv. Nobody cares about genotype 2 or 3.


http://hepatitiscnewdrugs.blogspot.com/2011/12/psi-7977-plus-ribavirin-newer-era-of.html

What I said above is pure fact, refernced by an attached article. Forget about who will hire who, or who will buy who, or whose pipeline is better. That is all speculative opinio' and means nothing. If you want to dispute this dummies facts please post a link referencing ANY phase 3 all oral study treating genotype type one hcv' or even genotype 2/3. The fact is you won't be able to!

In the meantime, this dummy will continue counting his days, 1050, 1049, 1048, 1047.....
Click to expand...

Told you dummy that the Genotype 1 data was coming. and it looks GOOOOOOOD. you had better believe this is being fast tracked. 100% Genotype 1 at 4 WEEKS?? Damn! No Peg interferon as I mentioned before. This is game changing data and even more to follow soon. Both Gild and BMS have solid, well seasoned Hep reps so all of those offers knocking on your door might not be as plentiful as you think. stay tuned...
 






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