ZB Surgical

A lot of those points are spot on. But I would say this, they are doing a better job of negotiating contracts. They guy in charge of that is great.

The new comp plan they made up is a joke. If you are one of their favorites you can earn $250k+. If you are a legacy distributor rep it is significantly less.

Recon commission rate and and the recon rep engagement is sort of a dead point. Those guys have about 18 months left of getting paid.

Dornoch was a great buy, though it needs a major update. Stryker got the neptune 2 FDA approved and launched the neptune 3 before they put an upgrade out.

Power is a joke - I don't think it can be fixed to the point of system 7 inside of 5 years. Stryker will keep advancing and has small bone. This is the most important product line in the bag.


It is a mixed bag here. There are some good people at the top. the question is whether they can turn it around quick enough. The division has come a long way in the last few years.

 

The Biologics bag is solid. They seem committed to sports (ex. acquisition). The company seems to be investing heavily in faster growing segments.

 

Does anyone know realistic numbers for first year for a surgical rep? Is 200 realistic? Just want to confirm numbers from recruiter aren't too inflated.

Debating leaving a company I'm doing well in for this opportunity.

 

You are going to have to talk to your manager. The comp plan is customized to the rep. There are guys carrying 2+ Mil in revenue who aren't close to $150,000. Some other reps with the same revenue are making $250,000. They build a comp plan for each rep that includes a base salary plus commission/ bonus for hitting your number. That commission rate is not the same for everyone.

They base it off of last years W2, even if you were with another company. If your manager likes you he can offer a higher number at plan. There is no easy way to figure out what your offer will be without knowing what you currently make and if the management structure likes you.

They have lost talented reps because they tried to play games. A lot of reps are figuring out that they are making half of what lesser reps are getting paid; more good reps will leave soon.

Again, I wouldn't even consider it unless you have the right hiring manager. One guy specifically will lie and manipulate you throughout the process. Most of the others are pretty good.

You won't have a clue what your offer is until they make it. You recruiter probably doesn't even have an idea, they are just giving the best case scenario.

 

Really appreciate the honest feed back.

The at plan number you get in your offer should then be realistic to what you would make, correct?

Also- mind shedding some light on who the manipulating manager is?

 

#25 hit the nail on the head. Take what the recruiter tells you with a grain of salt. It's their job to sell you on the position. Be very skeptical of anything "at plan". Sign a confidentiality agreement and ask to look at that particular territories numbers. Stick to your guns on salary and inflate your acceptable take home in that department 25-30%. Their new comp plan is garbage.

There are reps who were making $300k+ a few years ago that now that will be lucky to crack the lid on $100k and all while hitting quota. There are VERY few reps who are crushing quota and making more than their "at plan" number. Again, this goes back to knowing your market, the competitor, and the territory history. How many Stryker reps are in your soon to be territory? I would venture to say 5-7. How many of those are locked, stocked, and loaded Stryker accounts for the next 2-3 years? A previous poster made a great point as well. Zimmer is losing it's ass to Stryker because they are always buying shitty companies or products and have zero R&D. They have nice tourniquets but Stryker will literally give tourniquets away to buy the rest of the business. Zimmer Surgical doesn't have the financial backing to make those kinds of deals.

Zimmer Surgical management thinks they are slick by offering a base salary and then a commission hoping that "guaranteed" money will make you come on board. They do this because they want to grow the bag by paying reps considerably less money through the new comp plan. In fact, ask the recruiter how much the average sales reps take home pay has changed over the last 3 years. Those answers alone should be all you need to hear. If you are going to be in surgical go work for Stryker. Even if that means it's in Boise, Idaho. You will make 3 times the money and actually be proud of the product.
Good Luck.

 

Could not agree more with the post above. ZB Surgical will continue to lag the market until they replace the division head and completely change the culture. It doesn't matter how good the sales force is when you know the Dover office can't give you the vision and tools to succeed. Take the Stryker gig and know that you're with a sales-focused organization that wants to dominate in every category.

 

But this division provides a really long runway. Plus, you should see all of the companies we are about to buy.

 

Wait, like Compression Therapy? Or LDR? Stryker reps are terrified...you'll need that long runway.

 

Stryker isn't worried and won't be worried until ZB Surgical has functional large and small bone power and a real hood and helmet system. Considering that Dover can't get a new Dornoch cart out Stryker has little reason for concern.

 

Stryker is known for their underhanded strategies. Their products are second rate. In the end, they will be shining the shoes of the ZB reps.

 

Not sure why hiring endo reps is looked at as a bad thing? Sure they lack experience selling the surgical products when compared to a syk surgical rep, but any endo rep will tell you that syk surgical is the easiest job in device sales and moSt endo reps would swap places with their surgical counterpart. Surgical managers comp plan is also higher than endo RM's...Those surgical guys hardly work, unless you call them for a quote or need them to bring in some replacement batteries.

Endo has just launched its 5th camera in 12 years with the same resolution (all 1080p), thus same shit with a different name and a couple new features. If anything endo reps know how to sell products that aren't better than their competition. The 1588 can see ICG, so can storz, novadaq, and intuitive, with olympus on the horizon as well. Surgical reps are used to having the best products...not sure they have the experience "competing" in less than perfect situations...

The neptune 3 looks fancy, but in reality isn't much different aside from aesthetics.
The CTC acquisition doesn't look sexy but the market potential is huge with only one major player (covidien/kendall).

It will be interesting to see what ZB Surgical acquires in the next 6-12 months. I think that will give more insight into where this division is headed, not the hiring of endo reps.

 

The Endo reps at Stryker are good reps. It is a great division that has done extraordinarily well. From my perspective when you bring people over who are a making a lateral move career-wise and they go from a company like Stryker with a great culture, great products and a history of great pay and bring them to ZB Surgical there has to be a reason. Most of the best reps won't leave for a lateral move. The ones who come are chasing a paycheck and looking for a soft landing spot. There is nothing wrong with chasing a paycheck, it is why we all got into this business. Generally, Stryker doesn't hire reps from competitive companies who are making a lateral move. Stryker hires talented and driven reps who are ascending and they roll out the red carpet for you if you are a winner and perform. ZB Surgical is trying to recreate the Stryker model by stealing some of their average people, not by recreating a great process that leads to the development of great products and develops great people, which is how Stryker does it.

I think some legacy reps also feel like outsiders since leadership has decided to bring all of their own people from Stryker. Those reps were hired direct while most others were working for distributors. The ones recruited over from Stryker were given significantly better pay, a better career track and were treated better throughout the merger. The legacy reps, even those who did well were always treated as outsiders. Many were just glorified recon reps, but there were some really talented people who were never given a chance. There was a huge disconnect and communication gap between leadership and the field. It seems to be getting a little better, depending on who your manager is.

 

Sure seems strange for a company that doesn't have endo to hire a bunch of endo reps.

 

Because it's not about the proucts, it's about the people...if you're good,course good...it's not about the widget

Stryker Gallup is about finding the right personality, the right talent, the right attitude...not about who can sell a camera...the same applies to other companies with similar sales goals/culture

 

bottom line: is this a good place to be in medical?

 

Is it a good opportunity?

That all depends on your territory and your boss, others have said it before but it cannot be overstated. Some reps are $110k at plan, with an empty pipeline, a high quota and micromanager for a boss. Some are $250k at plan, reasonable quota with a great boss.

The product line isn't great and ZB as a whole is in transition. Simple things that Stryker can do with financing and placements ZV can't.

Understand your territory. Make sure you trust your boss, some are great and some are awful. If you have other opportunities I would think twice.

 

Response to #33

There's absolutely nothing wrong with hiring Stryker Endo Reps for a Surgical position. I would hire a used car salesman if they had the "gift". There are actually quite a few former Endo Reps that work for Zimmer Surgical who are doing an outstanding job. I can't speak for Surgical RM's salary any more than an Endo RM's salary. I also can't speak for the previous poster but the point I think they were trying to make is that if you are Kevin Durant and want to win a championship, you don't stay in OKC, you go to Golden State. That's not what this thread is about but I digress.

To say surgical guys hardly work is subjective to say the least. While we don't communicate much, I see my surgical rep fairly often in my accounts trying to make it happen. As a recon, endo, or neuro rep, you know everyday that when you walk into a hospital you are getting paid. As a surgical rep, you can waste weeks on a trial, months of follow ups, and constant roundtable bureaucracy to find out all of your time has been wasted because the budget was blown on a Hana table, etc. Sure, surgical reps aren't in the OR EVERY AM doing cases, but they sure as hell don't have the earning potential as the aforementioned reps and they sure as shit don't share in the recon's commission.

Not sure why #33 went off on an Endo tangent about camera's but that's probably because you are a former Endo rep who is now a Zimmer Surg rep or Zimmer Surg regional manager. Stryker sure reps definitely have the luxury of not having to compete all of the time. But should we blame them? They have better products. Their battle is merely with capital budgets and time constraints. Zimmer surgical reps however get their teeth kicked in on the daily trying to justify their Stryker knockoff products in a mostly Stryker friendly environment. Yes, Stryker Endo has a reputation for having to work in less hospitable circumstances than other divisions. They are the red headed step child of Stryker much like Zimmer Surgical is to their recon brethren.

Again, Yes, I read SYK has a new Neptune coming out. It's not much different from the Neptune 2 but guess what? At least it's an upgrade to market to their customers. Where is the Zimmer Dornoch 2? You guys had the opportunity to buy a shitty company, grab market share, hopefully change the name, and build a NEW "Dornoch" in the meantime. However, Zimmer Surgical is still holding their proverbial " coupler" in their hand. (Some of you get it) Surely, they will come out with something new at some point. But let's be real, Stryker will have kicked the original Dornoch down the street and locked down multi year contracts before the Dornoch 2 release. Zimmer Surgical: Can you afford to buy out contracts in the same manner SYK is currently doing to regain market share? No. (That was a redundant question)

Lastly, when it comes to new products, Zimmer Surgical will always be the last to the show. #33, how many times have you been told something new is coming to your bag only to be fooled again. Congrats on your CTC acquisition Zimmer. I understand someone else has the bulk market share of that division as well. To the kid asking if this is the right market space to join: Yes, if it is with Stryker.